You COULD buy the entry-level Mac Pro for $7000

or get this build for $4000 that's a fuckton more powerful AND has 2 monitors (with stands!) and just stick Hackintosh on it.

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/...

My toaster has a better value vs cost than the Mac does.

@FrodoSwaggins thank you

@FrodoSwaggins actually if you look at in-depth specs on the GPUs in my build you'll see they stand toe-to-toewith the one in the entry-level Mac Pro except there's 3 instead of 1 and all 3 have a higher memory clock AND marginally higher GPU clock (1100-1200MHz vs 1340-1380MHz core, 6780MHz vs 8000MHz eff. RAM.) They also both have 256-bit busses, so there's that too.

the monitors are IPS 27" 4k monitors at 60Hz with Freesync and LED backlight, 178° H x 178° V view angle and 1.07 billion colors. Unless you're referring to the Display P3 colorspace, which is Apple's attempt to transplant like one part of DCI-P3 into the sRGB colorspace, so it's not much better than regular sRGB (which nearly everything uses.) The new Apple monitor also uses 10-bit color (from what little i can find on it) and the monitors i've bundled have split-screen and PiP modes at the hardware level, which (I imagine) could be useful for, say, a video editing studio!

no it's not devrant

@dfox

@FrodoSwaggins ooh, and if we're getting into iPhones:

iPhone XS Max vs Galaxy S10:

the XS Max's CPU is a hexacore running at (2 cores at 2.5GHz, 4 at 1.59GHz) while the Galaxy S10 is an octocore running at (2 cores at 2.73GHz, 2 cores at 2.31GHz, 4 at 1.95GHz).
RAM? 4GB vs 6-10GB
GPU? quad-core 1100MHz vs octo-core 1900MHz
Price? $1000 vs $800

yet again, Apple is out-muscled for a lower price xD

@FrodoSwaggins also, since there's basically zero specs on MPX so far except "something something power delivery", there's no real way to compare performance yet aside from Apple-provided multipliers from unknown base values for the highest-end machine. However, from how they're making it sound on their site, you don't even *get* any MPX bays without at least an extra purchase, if they'll even be available on the entry-level box. All i'm seeing is standard PCI-e slots for absolute stock (1x x16, 2x x8) without an I/O card (which adds a half-size x4 slot.)

"Up to 2.6GB/s sequential read and 2.7GB/s sequential write performance."
PCI-e 3.0 x4 SSDs can get up to 3.9GB/s under ideal real-world conditions, so either we've got a PCI-e bus running a proprietary slot or we're eating the I/O card's only x4 slot. In the case of the I/O card, again, their material makes it sound like a separate purchase, so it's either M.2 or SATA 3 on stock, which are nothing special.

@M1sf3t no emojis, and this was a comment, so no tags.

@M1sf3t 's all good.

Oh do I wish people could stop ranting about the new monitor and computer from Apple. They're finally going in the right direction, so why the hell are you fucking them over?

I’d choose the cheese grater over that diy pc.

@ScriptCoded how are they going in a good direction? Every model they release is more and more expensive. Trashcan at least offered similar price to what you would get for if you bought hardware yourself. For new Mac Pro many people already proved that base model is overpriced by 2-2,5K

Also, let's see how they do with the cooling. I'm sceptic about that passive CPU and GPU cooling combined with such hardware...

@mindev I’m sure they have though about it. They would have stress tested and thought of this.

@FrodoSwaggins thing is: all those big movie studios already have the more expensive monitors with high color accuracy

@mindev It's not even meant as a consumer grade computer. The word pro has been used a crazy lot, but this for sure is true pro gear. For many professionals who actually need crazy hardware these aren't bad prices. Their monitor for example is competing against reference monitors that can go beyond $40 000. I'm not an Apple fan at all, but for the first time in a while they're actually allowing for some form of customization.

@Parzi
Besides, consider that in a studio that price difference isn't all that much compared to the things that really take money - people and land. It makes sense to spend more to get good quality and reliable tools (and that's just what pro Apple devices are) and avoid something that's just hacked together. This is actually on the reasonable side, some pro stuff can cost ridiculous amounts of money and still be worth it over time.

This is also why for pro applications the "free as in free beer" component of FOSS is pretty much useless, they'd gladly pay for even a small increase in productivity because pro users are hardcore af and any difference gets magnified, and besides, it costs way more to pay pro folks than to buy software.

@M1sf3t Isn’t that actually a thing now with those USB mouths?

@FrodoSwaggins actually not because "6 vs 8 cores", but the raw power per core too. Most of this info you want me to see I can't find, so please provide it and i'll be happy to change my stance if need be.

The Mac Pro specs are impressive. Here’s the catch:

Apple will produce this computer the way it did the “trashcan” pro before it, and the tower before that.

A high performance machine at an incredibly high price where the value is derived solely from your specific application- and in the case of the Mac Pro, it’s a small niche of people. Their components are expensive, overly so. Take it from someone who took a company computer in only to be charged over $400 for a 1TB hybrid SSD on an iMac.

They’ll then ignore it and make little to no updates to the hardware for years- the same way they did with the previous Pro machines. Their specs will grow older, rival technology more performant, and the public will once again talk about how Apple has abandoned the professional community, which it does.

Apple is all about shareholder value and constantly designing and updating Pro level machines with this price bracket and performance, and yes- a $1k stand don’t drive stock performance- thus, no shareholder value. I’m waiting to see if they retain their “assembled in America” approach to that Mac Pro.

Let’s not pretend that Apple’s new Pro machine will do anything other than be bought by a small amount of people and garner media attention. And any argument by regular users who won’t buy it and have little insight into its use value is hard to view as anything other than fanboy vs. hater.

The rest of us are largely indifferent or just have fun with the jokes. In defense of the self-builder rigs- it’s not about outright performance or “same for less”, it’s about the level of performance that you can get, and are you willing to pay the difference for what you’d perceive to be the differences if you bought the Pro.

@FrodoSwaggins I’m interested in seeing what happens as well. The only thing I personally have against it is that the pattern on the front triggers my trypophobia haha.

But what if I need to open more than 5 tabs in chrome? Don't i need the 1.5TB of RAM that the maxed out mac pro offers?

@spyridonas just do like i did and amass 3TB of pagefile

@dontbeevil now wait to see 4x the price of normal SSD, because Apple. And sheeps will praise them for it, even if the drive will be no different than others.

@mindev my point the entire time

@FrodoSwaggins is right. There are a lot of things to criticize apple for but their product quality is certainly not one of the.

Most android phones won't last more than 2-3 years.
Comparing the hardware of a Samsung and iPhone is pointless. iPhone may have less specs (I doubt that) but they will still outperform android phones by a huge margin.

And everyone argues how overpriced their products are. ( Some definitely are. Not all though).
But people would be willing to pay that price because nothing else like that exists.
And while everyone keeps comparing the hardware cost, they don't into account all the money that Apple spent into RnD to perfect the design and the software. Mac OS and ios outperforms Windows and Android by a huge margin

That doesn't make apple a less shittier company though. Their after sales services literally suck. They try to exploit customers to the max amount they can.

@dontbeevil I did say their after sales service is shit.

I just said their product quality is good. Especially the software part. The keyboard is just 1 issue. Users of other manufacturers have to deal with such crap on daily basis.

You can not expect an HP laptop to last 4+ years and still work like it used to.

@ewpratten how do you quantify the value of a toaster?

I guess you could take the lump sum cost of the toaster less the cost of a frying pan (which would be the other way you toast bread if there wasn’t a toaster), divide this by the time it takes to toast on a frying pan less the time it takes to toast with a toaster. Then work out how many times a week you need bread toasted. Times the value by that and then by 48, assuming your on holiday or sick 4 weeks a year. This should tell you how much ‘money per time saved’ value the toaster has given you per year. Example units: £/min p.a.

Come to think of it, Wow!! Toasters are actually a very good value proposition. I am going to stock my shed up with toasters now. Be right back.