Teachers HAVE TO stop using Windows Notepad or Dev-C++ to teach.

>Dev-C++
Ok that one I agree since I did have some teacher back years ago did that

>Notepad
lol, what the flying fuck? I mean I do use *Notepad++* alot myself for alot stuff but Vainilla Windows Notepad...seriously?

@legionfrontier Yep. Especially during lectures.

Using the above both still speaks out a way more advanced teachers than those who still insist on using TURBO-C

@Jason Are you an real, commercial Dev? It's the first time I've seen an opinion like that. Do you really value remembering all the methods instead of writing quick and reliable code?
Also, it's so fucking unprofessional to write a code in notepad during lecture and think for next twenty minutes why code isn't working. It happens all the fucking time to those PhDs. Not using technology that is available to you is moronic and should not be propagated. Later you get junior devs that don't even know how to create a project but can tell you how linker works. Fuck that.

We still used codeblocks last year. Crashed every other minute, super annoying... It was mandatory :/

@Jason Easy, boy. I need to say, though, that I'm disappointed. This community doesn't need people attitude like that. Well... I guess it's normal for people to just attack someone personally if they can't defend their opinion.
Anyway, back to the topic. Two universities, one private and one public. I'm in private, my friend's in public. We both had lectures with Master or higher and both of them were showing their code in either notepad or Dev-C++. Their code was shit, and not clean at all. People learning from such teachers also won't keep their code clean. Guys from my group all asked me to help them with their very simple programs because they couldn't find bugs. Teacher also couldn't help them. Only when I cleaned their code (and it wasn't as simple as key combination available in any IDE) I could help them. My favourite text was "Don't change that! Teacher told us to do it exactly like that!".
Good thing no one in company writes code like that. I can't even imagine someone getting a job without basic IDE using skills.

@wildebeest Yeah. Let's use ancient IDEs without updates because teacher is some idiot and don't want to change anything to improve.

@Jason Yes, that's right. But teachers don't show beginners how to write it simple and clean.
Let's assume we are back to the very beginnings of programmer journey. We have never ever seen code and never coded. We are simply replicating steps that teacher has done a moment ago. We don't know how to write it so it's easier to read. We don't even know if we have to have exactly the same amount of spaces. And example shown has some ridiculous amount of brackets. And so we have to count them, because nothing is showing us what we are missing. It's plain stupid. People from my group often add empty lines between each line of code to "male it easier to read". They didn't create any methods but added more whitelines to separate each block of code.

@Jason With experience often comes knowledge. Let beginners use not Notepad but some IDE. To show them how to do it. And make them want to learn.

@Jason why do you even use an OS to Programm? I hope you don't use Internet either.

A programming language is nothing but a tool itself.

You can create new tools while using those already created, Unsless you want to Start a cake by creating the universe.

One of my teachers was always using Emacs

@irene
1) It doesn't even try to teach importance of code formatting.
2) It's long not supported and has many compability issues.
3) It's not much better than writing code in notepad and that's one of the reasons people don't want to learn programming.
4) C++ is not the easiest language ever for beginners and no code completion or any other support makes it a pain to learn programming while using it.
5) Why should I use free but really bad tool if I can use also free but well-made one? CLion for example. If you're a student it's completely free.
... And many, many more reasons.

@irene It was just an example. But the fact that you get to know only few built-in functions is also part of the problem. Lecturers won't teach you anything more advanced than few basic methods and so, if you are not interested in coding, you won't learn at all. I still remember first time I've launched Android Studio and started reading through autocompletion, other classes than mine within IDE, formatted code with simple shortcut and saw hints when my code was especially bad.
Within month I've learned more about coding than in last 5-6 years of lectures in Dev-Cpp.

@irene Fortunately I am interested I in coding, but many of people I know are not. Most of them came to CS for reasons unknown for me. But even before university, there were programming lessons and then even I struggled because of this IDE and no experience nor knowledge.
Also lack of auto formatting and almost no knowledge about its importance, makes it VERY hard to help people if their code isn't working. Just last year people were asking for help with very, very simple programs and helping them took a lot of time because they made a lot of new lines where they thought logic were changing, used absolutely no indentation and such. All because there's no auto formatting option in this IDE.

@irene It's okay, but those are your experiences. You are interested in the topic and are willing to go lengths to learn. People that don't want to become developers are just suffering through the classes. And in result - are discouraged.

@irene Yeah, I guess it's true. But we really got off the thread. I understand your opinion that Dev-Cpp is not that bad for beginners, but I still think that using such an outdated software is not a good idea.

Lucky man. Our C/C++ Professor is the only one in our whole building using just the Overhead-Projector and his handwritten stuff. PowerPoint is bad he says. No one needs editors he says. ':D