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Is this for something that will be installed locally on the users computer?
The main reason to use html instead of windows forms is that its easy to use over network, it has better built in support for accessibility fir disabled people.
You can do similar with blazor which compiles razor and c# into web assembly. -
I hear you man. I really fucking hate how frontend is done. Mad respect for those who can do but I refuse to spend on hours fiddling with html+js+css. I can do it but it's so fucking boring and mind-numbing. There's like a dozen "drag&drop" web builders and none of them work properly... It's a fucking pain.
Lately I'm experimenting with using a Godot3 (the game engine) for my web interfaces. Not production ready, but for my own tools it's much more easier to use Godot's UI elements and containers and just place buttons and stuff where I want.
Maybe I should look into ZebKit, using HTML5 Canvas for UI sounds almost reasonable to me at this point -
@Voxera I understand the concept of deployment and ease of access but I hate the design workflow of web.
It's gotten better but I remember being abused over not knowing. Different browsers Render the same tags differently back in the day -
@Voxera I mean seriously first week on the job told them I wasn't a web guy needed time to learn
Assholishness probably also because I objected to staying till 4 am and still being expected to show up at 8.
Later learned the guy is a pederast and he's running a front. And just liked making excuses get rid of people.
How nice -
@Hazarth lately I was able to sneak in Godot 3 instead of Windows Forms and Web in the company production environment and I am really really happy. Some things are hard but I am building experience on a game engine I really like
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@AvatarOfKaine Ok i can understand that.
I also started out with windows forms, originally on the pre release of visual basic a few months before it went live.
But it took a long time before the tooling for web forms got the tools for a truly responsive experience, the first program that really handled resizing well had almost 50% of its code dedicated to the gui ;)
With dotnet it got a lot better with docking and anchoring but by then I had already worked with the web for several years and never really looked back. -
Why frontend development is awful? Because a website is supposed to simply a document. To be read. That's why we have paragraph, heading 1 to 6, emphasis, article, blockquote, ordered list, unordered list, etc.
But then people wanted to make it into an app. That's the start of the downward spiral of frontend development hell.
We have flexbox and grid now, but in older time, people used table for making layout. Even though table is only supposed to present tabular data to user. See how crazy is that?
Native app developments are much easier when it comes to UI, because they are supposed to be an app, from the start. -
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@Voxera Yup, but it has never really recovered from the mess. Framework like React and Vue makes it easier, but still not as easy as native Windows development.
Also it's quite recent that it can really become app by itself. It's definitely not as old as 25 years. Remember how people has to rely to Java applet in the past? Macromedia flash? Silverlight? Anyone?
They may run in browser, but it's not like HTML has been used as an app at the time. HTML simply host these applet. -
@daniel-wu absolutely agree. HTML is a great tool but it becomes a nightmare when used for something it wasn’t intended for.
It may have evolved and improved over the years but in the end it’s still a tool to make static documents.
It doesn’t mean you can’t do dynamic apps with it. It just means that it will be a pain because it’s the wrong tool. -
@Lensflare Yup, it's unthinkable for WPF XAML or Android XAML to have <paragraph> or <heading> or <blockquote> in them. That itself shows what HTML is for.
It's like using a wrench to hit nails. Sure, the nails can still go into the wood.. But... :-D -
@daniel-wu are you all just agreeing with Truman ?
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@Voxera don't get me wrong even anchoring left some problems. There is a need to specify some of the resize behavior better and the newer delegate.? Syntax and event handler+=method is much better than invokerequired everywhere and begininvoke callas etc
It's just that with web I feel the purpose of rad went bye bye
It's like designing a tkinter app
Till you run it you have no idea what it looks like. And the dependency on a fault point that used to install dancing stripper sprites and people's obnoxious faces in search bars on windows explorer is not something I relish. Browsers have too much junk stuffed into them. -
@daniel-wu I disagree, I started building applications in web in the late 90s, sure, in the first iterations we did have a java applet but only for the predecessor of ajax.
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@Voxera extensions ? Silverlight ? Java ? Audio video handlers protocol handlers etc etc
I'm saying the browser is one of the primary exploit points
Also the memory footprint is larger than it should be
The paradigm of stateless programming bothers me to.
Where you either store everything in a database or a session state.
God I'm sick of being unhappy why do all these people do the same things ?
Today I wandered into a convenient store intending on sitting and having some coffee. Two homo chomos hung uncomfortably close to the register and some jackass tainted the sitting area with some nasty smell to make sitting their uncomfortable all over again. What's the point ?
I'm not sure really is the thing.
Why make everything uncomfortable everywhere ? It doesn't get people any time it just deprives those of us who used to change things of our happiness. And makes us jackasses.
I feel like being expected to handcode a user interface by supposed progressives is the most ass backwards idiotic tech decision with long and wide ranging consequences anyone ever farted out of the asshole god bored into their ugly faces!
Why the hell would I want to use web when I could use windows forms ?
Why is there no equivalent to the visual designer that's usuable ?
I mean I get it for more customized things
But why would I want to fuck with css when instead I could do about the same thing and store them in a settings file and point and click on a series of dropdowns and see the results as I create them ?
Why would I want to fuck around with an interface a resize destroys ?
Why would I want to mess with html tagging or tk or tcl containers when I could just drag an item into a window and update it's properties and add some fucking event handlers the stubs of which are automatically generated by a single DoubleClick??!!??
I hate it
It's slow
I want my fucking ui to be done quickly !
Am I just missing some vital tool that costs 5 grand ?
rant