I always kinda wonder what it with C/C++ devs and their urge to discredit the efforts made by users of other languages.

I am on a C++ reddit. Where all we talk about is C++ methods, design, etc. We don't really talk about other languages very much. If someone shows up and starts pushing this and that in the comments we just downvote and move on. Practically no conversation about it.

When someone talks about the pros and cons vs other languages in an article, we have a discussion on the merits and state of the art of each language. The moderators are pretty good about getting rid of language trolls.

Most of the people on that reddit are professionals.

Now on devrant, we give shit to everyone. I have actually gained a lot of respect for the non C++ devs here because of this. They know how to dish it out.

Where are you seeing this pattern?

I don't give a fuck unless it's desktop JavaScript in a Chrome container. Kill it with fire.

@Demolishun No, it was me just recommending some guy that wanted to learn how to write code (like the very basics) to use TS + Deno (just to take away a lot of shit so the bloke could focus on the fundamentals like logic, control flow, functions etc. etc.).

Then some C/C++ dev went on a rampage and said I should not be telling people how to learn to code if I use TS + Deno and that I'm only a stupid webdev (hint: I do cryptography stuff) and that learning people TS + Deno is only if I want people to become stupid webdevs and be stuck there forever.

He didn't realize my intentions for using TS + Deno was to learn them the very basics of writing code so they can grow from there.

It was just a random Discord server.

@iiii Yea, JavaScript in a Chrome container is kind of a pain.

I'm definitely guilty of making such things but most of those are private projects that just need to work.

But this was TS + Deno, so more similar to just NodeJS or PHP without funky shit.

@FinlayDaG33k Lol that's a completely different story. That has nothing to do with C++ vs other languages. You suggested a total beginner should start by using an extremely specific language and environment. 99% of Deno + TS users had extensive experience with NodeJS and JS before switching over, or at least worked with someone possessing such experience. There's a total of 0 tutorials about "learning to code with Deno and TS" available online, and all resources assume the person is at least mostly proficient in JavaScript or another similar language before learning either TS or Deno. You suggested pretty much the worst possible way someone could learn to code, the only way to make it worse would be if you suggested they start with Lisp. You're a fucking moron, and I bet the whole debate started something like this:

- other dev: they should start with another language, or at least with plain JS and Node

- you: Deno is better than Node

- other dev: why?

- you: [mentions Rust]

Maybe because other languages run on shoulders of C/C++?

People recommend what they know I guess. If I know someone is "just learning" I would push toward Python. It is like playing with legos. In the long run they might need to learn something else. However, people could spend their whole career in Python. I really enjoyed combining modules I wrote in C++ with Python.

@hitko Actually, it does have a lot to do with C++ vs other languages.

He said people *should* learn C/C++ as a first language because it learns you how computer and programs work.

He wants people to learn how a car engine and the Otto cycle works before driving a car.

I mentioned they should use TS + Deno so they can learn the very fundamentals of coding ("learning how to drive") before going deeper into it ("learning how the engine works").

The only reason I use TS + Deno is because:

- TS allows you to go from "no-typing" to "soft-typing" and sets you up to go to stricty-typing.

- Deno runs TS out of the box (NodeJS requires additional setups I do not want to bother people with just yet).

This is not "the possible way" someone should learn to code, it is *the best way*.

Or are you gonna tell me you should learn how to operate a car's throttle, brakes, steer, use your blinkers, clutch and shift... On your first few minutes of driving ever...

Take away distractions, have them get comfortable with the very basics before increasing difficulty.

It is a proven method of learning pretty much about anything.

Don't overload newbies with a massive truckload of information, it's a proven way to discourage people.

@Demolishun True, I started out as a PHP dev and now I mainly chill in Maple, TS and occasionally some Rust (mainly my car that runs on Rust - yes this started as a meme before I realized Rust is actually quite a nice language).

I even made some PHP extensions in Rust for work.