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Feel ya. Just know that most negotiations come down to set salary scales. You don't ever have any real negotiation power, you're just fighting against a number you can't see to prevent them from low-balling you.
This is why it is essential for employees to share their salaries with each other.
@SortOfTested I understand this much & agree. I guess it’s more of a conversation than a negotiation per se either way you’re advocating for yourself & what you can do and that’s the hardest thing for me to do.
Yesss! Why is it so frowned upon when employees ask each other about this?
In the meantime I’ll keep looking for other jobs
Pay secrecy (illegal in the US, but still present in contracts because it's merely unenforceable) allows companies to keep employees in the dark on what others are paid as a means of quashing discontent, and avoid having to pay reasonable wages to all people. It's just scumbaggetry.
The thing to watch out for is that companies, even though they know they can't terminate for it, will cook up other reasons to get rid of you if they suspect you're guilty of it. Build strong relationships with your colleagues for this reason.
@EDragon Two reasons.
1) Employers can't as easily haggle down employees who have low negotiation skills.
2) If an employee finds out that a co-worker on equal level has been able to negotiate a better deal, some folks direct their frustration against said employee instead of the employer, which creates a bad company atmosphere.
chris voss: never split the difference
I feel compelled to clarify that I am NOT a millennial or from the “never ending praise” while growing up generation.
In fact I’ve heard the opposite and that might be why it feels this horrible to just speak up to be treated fairly.
Just in case anybody was dying to know
Salary negotiations suck for sure because the recruiter has dealt with so many candidates already. I'm a little tempted to just hire someone to do the negotiation for me and let him take a cut of the increase if there is a service like that.
This is why I dream about FIRE sometimes. The power of always being able to walk away. *drool*
drewbie8322yI feel you. I was so disappointed with my raise. The best way to get a salary increase is to find a new job.
"If you can't tell someone to go to hell then you can't negotiate with them" -Jordan Peterson
irene33882yAssuming your position is important you can just be confident. The process it to filter out people that aren't assertive. "The wage I am being paid isn't competitive and/or doesn't allow me to meet financial goals. I would like this amount."
I was working with massive company. They put me with someone several levels above me in the organization hierarchy.
He said, "That is the kind of raise we can't sustain."
I responded, "What I am asking for seems like a modest and competitive salary."
He said, "I don't think we can afford to give out raises."
To which I replied, "Hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of product made and shipped using the software I made and maintain."
He said, "We recognize that your software has played a big role in meeting objectives."
I replied, "Yes so do I. Which is why I don't think what I am asking for is unreasonable."
"Okay. We will work the financials out."
That amount is half what I make now.
@F1973 I thought I did although the heat of the moment is always different.
I expressed my gratitude for the opportunity.
I brought up the fair wages for the jobs with my experience & skills in my area, I mentioned what I liked about the company & hoped to accomplish & help expand etc.
It’s still awkward & feels as if it was not taken well.
@F1973 thank you for your kind words even with all my tag fails.
*Update, I was asked to sign something & when I asked to discuss it first, I was suddenly no longer needed.
@F1973 it was a total fucking scam!
I was upset about it but
I'm relieved I don't have to contribute to a SPAM factory.
@F1973 of course! Big time! & I wanted to discuss it further after all it was only supposed to be a 30 day trial.
Pay was stupid which I was willing to live with for that period— then instead of discussing it, they snuck it into the “no sharing trade secrets” agreement and then said if I don’t sign it they don’t see us going any further.
In short, they thought I didn’t have a Google machine to see how dirt cheap I was, once I wasn’t willing to be taken advantage of I wasn’t worth it.
Although they were giving more to do everyday, for cheap!
They played themselves, no wonder devs don’t spend more than 2-3 months there or end up starting competing companies.
@F1973 i take responsibility for not starting off negotiating better that was me but they only told me I was being paid 30% of what the other dev was making after the fact!
They can build their shitty sites themselves!
And happy fucking Sunday. My fave.
@F1973 yessir xp points 😆