Started using Vim and the more i use it, the more using regular editors feels like a waste of time.

Anything other than vim is waste of time for sure.. But I do find atom ( text editor ) to be really awesome

I'm still to find the allure in vim. I do use it occasionally, but the simple (and probably most important) thing about not being able to edit ehen you open a file confuses me. I usually move the cursor and start typing almost immediately, triggering some weird shortcut in the process.

Any good link abou vim you guys can share? Willing to give it a proper opportunity. :)

@SISheogorath though vim seems simple but it is really complicated if you try to learn just the basic shortcuts. So just go with the simple and most used ones

@SISheogorath heard about vim tutor ? That's an inbuilt tutorial that you can access

@SISheogorath moreover it's a self help type so don't even need to depend on someone 😁

Welcome to the cult of Vim. You'll never figure out how to exit.

@apisarenco you can use it through an SSH session.

@coffeeframe currently i am playing around with certain plugs such as startify.
Now i have a splashscreen that shows the 50 Blessings logo as ascii art and "50 BLESSINGS" below. Next up would be trying to animate that.

@R5on11c if you're not already familiar, Vundle is a great package manager for Vim. https://github.com/VundleVim/...

The editor/IDE should make coding as simple as possible, so the developer can concentrate on the code. Learning thousands of shortcuts and basically a new language, just to be able to control the editor, is the worst case in my eyes. It might be the best terminal editor, but welcome to the 21st century, we have desktops and a mouse. Even on distant machines I can just connect with WinSCP or any Linux alternative and edit through Sublime or whatever.

The thing with Vim is that i don't need to thibk about anything that isn't right at my fingertips. I don't need to reach out for any gui implemented function.

Also i don't need to woery about any nieche case or function.
File too big? No problem.
Can i search between 3 files at the same time? Easily

You can simply tap out of your usual limitations. I do agree that it takes a bit to learn vim and it takes a while. But once you have a certain base knowledge and you got used to the way vim works, you don't really spend much time thinking about how anything works. At least in my case.

I use Vim since almost a week. Editing and writing files looks like wizardry from the outside but is simply the intuitive combination of simple concepts and functions on the inside. And that is what makes Vim so powerful. Its simple and easy in it's core and can ve used and personalized toal a powerful tool.

@apisarenco A few things. First off, Vim over SSH can be used for more than just Dev. It's also useful for admin tasks like editing config files or regular old text files. Some version of it (usually Vi) generally also comes standard in nearly every Distro so it's pretty much always available.

It's really not that slow, especially if used in conjunction with something like Mosh.

Not everyone devs with different testing and prod environments. Some people just have their own servers that they use for whatever, or Dev with SSH on a weak machine like a Chromebook. I ran a headless Tor node for years that I configured entirely with Bash and Vim.

My University's CS department even mandates that students do their homework and projects on the department servers over SSH, generally with Vim. This way you never get the "it worked on my machine scenario" and it can be submitted directly from the command line. Just type a quick command and boom it runs some unit tests and sends it right to the professor.

People other than corporate devs use Vim, and their use cases are no less important than yours.

@apisarenco you are kinda taking blind-shots here. I was merely sharing my viewpoint here and my experiences with vim. Also you seem a tad to comfortable with throwing around with dotNet examples.

I currently work in a dotNet core project, and we have generators for most of the redundant code. Also you can pretty much implement every algorithm you need into vim if you desire to do so. And there are already Plugins for those who want to have IDE functionality from what i can gather from a quick google search.

I am not trying to glorify Vim. Where i work we use VScode VisualStudio, emacs, Atom and Vim next to each other all alike. Everyone should take what fits his or her needs the best.

Also, there is no Vim hype. Hell people are even afraid to look at it by default.

The way you describe the issues with Vim shows that barely had any contact with it, and i am not trying to convince you to use it. But please do more research and be more constructive...

@apisarenco My home environment is around half a dozen devices with non-similar roles and configurations. Using something like salt stack in that environment is overkill. It provides zero benefit and adds additional complexity to my site.

As for nano. I don't use nano because I don't like nano, I like Vim. That's just my workflow and baselessly criticizing it because it differs from yours is absurd.

Your assertion about SSH teaching dev on production is baseless without further elaboration and data.

The fact that you tried it and didn't like it is not my problem. Different people have different workflows and if it didnt work for you I'm sorry but that happens. Personally IDEs don't work for me, I prefer to be hands on with my work and know the cogs in my machine so to speak. Thats why I use Arch over something like Debian. Debian is great but not my style.

And yeah, sometimes we in the dev/FLOSS community can be overenthusiastic, but we're doing it out of love not maliciousness.

@apisarenco I understand where you're coming from. I don't like tiling window managers like i3, awesome, or whatever the new hipster WM is today. I can't be bothered to learn a dozen new key combinations to do something as simple as opening a web browser. So I don't. I get that some people love them and that they get a marginal speed benefit in their day-to-day, but I tried it and didn't like it. So I use something else instead.

And that's perfectly okay.

Don't let other people dictate how YOU run YOUR systems. That up to you and you alone. If someone tells you about something cool and you think it might provide a benefit, give it a try. If it doesn't interest you, than don't. If you tried it and don't like it, go back to your old thing. Don't keep trying to tough it out, it never ends well.

" Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself." -Anton Szandor LaVey

@apisarenco you can open multiple buffers and execute through each the desired command or command combination. So practically you can do that.
I can see that you percieve the current reaction to Vim as a hype. There are not to many Vim users in comparison to other IDEs and finding likeminded people is refreshing from time to time.
I can also see the appeal of out-of-the-box functionality with easy to learn usage from your IDE listings.
The thing is though, that noone forces you to plow through Vim until it fits your needs or you give up on it. I never said it makes everything faster for every developer. All i am saying is that it makes life faster for ME, which is my personal experience. I would invite people to try Vim and see for themselves if it fits their style.

But what i can't stand is dumbing it down to "Vim doesn't do what i need out of the box so it's useless" or as you said it to be for "building very simple scripts". This is simply not true.

@apisarenco I think you're misunderstanding me. I'm aware that developing on prod is bad. Nobody is
arguing that point. What I'm saying is that you're drawing a link between using a text editor over SSH and developing on a production system without anything to back it up.

Vim makes plenty of sense to use, and I use it every single day. I'm not a fan of programs that hold my hand or think they know more about what I want than I do, and those hours spent learning Vim were something I enjoyed, which itself has intrinsic value.

Also, you're looking at this from a completely corporate developer oriented perspective. There are other people with other use cases that are just as legitimate and just as important. For some of these people, vim is the perfect tool.

Now let's take a look at salt stack. Say I take your hype at face value and deploy salt stack in my environment. At that point not only do I need to learn it, but other relevant personnel may need to learn it as well, and it may not even be the optimal option for our environment. Now I've wasted hours or days of not only deploying and learning salt stack, but removing it to reverse the damage. At this point, how are you different from those people who seemingly forced you to use Vim?

@apisarenco Sure thing. I ran a home server as a personal Minecraft server. Arch linux, completely headless. Got Arch installed on the disk and opened up an SSH port. Threw it next to my router with a physical connection with no mouse or keyboard and completely configured the rest over SSH. After a while I started adding other services to it since Minecraft wasn't really demanding on the hardware. DHCP, DNS caching, torrent seeding for various libre software. All Vim over SSH. every bash or perl script, every conf file, every .*rc, and every cron job. After that I set up other machines over SSH. Why? Because I enjoyed it.

@apisarenco I'm not saying it's for every scenario. Not once have I said that. I also never said it was the best. That's subjective. I did say that I prefer it for what I do and that you can use whatever other text editor or IDE you want. Nobody is going to stop you. We're also not going to go into a post saying "Visual Studio is great!" and crap all over everyone who uses it because we don't like it ourselves.

Also, you're right. It's useful for a very specific use case. Editing text. That's because it's a text editor. You can use it any time there is text that needs to be edited or otherwise generated. I've never said that you should use Vim as your version control, or as your hypervisor, or anything of the sort. I've said some people use it for text and it's perfectly capable at that job

@apisarenco That's perfectly fine. Not everybody who uses Vim is a developer. It's unfortunate that you don't find Vim to be to your liking, but some people do. TL;DR, there's no need to be hostile or to start another editor holy war. I'm not going to tell you how to manage your workflow and I would only ask that you extend the same courtesy to others.
Good day now, I've an episode of Twin Peaks to finish. :)