At a friend's party, I met one of the guys I've known from High school, and talk about what we've become:

Him: ...so yeah, now I study CS, I code some C, I dislike Java, blablablablabla I'm coding some OS and embedded software, blablablabla, and you, what do you code in?

Me: Oh, I learned everything I know by myself, still learning, and I'm mostly doing some PHP and Javascript. Doing websites and apps is cool.

Him: but those aren't programming languages? I mean, you can't manage memory, and blablablabla-

Me: Ó_Õ * Quickly dashed my ass off to talk with some ladies and boozed myself to forget what I just heard *

Yeah, you know, fuck it
Either you build cool stuff or you don't
Take my ++

@runfrodorun hope it's ok batman only knows PHP and JS :D

@ElToastGrande Eggsactly!

It's wrong to say that managing memory is programming. JS, or PHP is programming. Programming is the essence of instructing the processor what to do. C is programming, Python is programming. JS is programming. And so on.

They're all programming, and I fail to see why they wouldn't be.

Wouldn't HTML/JS/PHP be considered more scripting than Programming? Looking for clarification, not to start a war. I've seen programming defined as sending instructions to the computer but client side none of those do that (I add client side because I don't know what PHP does server side). Client side HTML is interpreted, JS is interpreted, and PHP generates HTML(?) Which is interpreted.

Python is a weird bastard because I've seen it interpreted; and compiled. But I'm pretty sure the compilation is just for easy interpreting. I don't think it actually breaks into C or anything.

Java is another weird one because it's interpreted- but it's interpretation is translated into machine commands by the JVM; so it's like a script but runs like a program.

@Rudi scripting is a form of programming

The two aren't mutually exclusive

Programming is about giving a computer instructions.

With that definition I could really trigger people and say that HTML is a programming language

Thanks :)

@Hedgepig by that definition, HTML is a programming language. But by that definition, literally anything could be a programming language. I mean, would you also call Excel a programming language? How about drawing a bitmap in Ms paint?

C is far too high level for real programming. You barely handle any memory yourself in C let alone registers. Now I do assembly next to PHP i'm so much more now....

Utter bullshit of course use the tools that suit the job. Mostly we don't need to mess with lower level stuff. I would bet you are far more proficient than he is (including scoring chicks😉)

@irene That's cool! I didn't know that :) Just to clarify, I'm not saying that drawing a bitmap Couldn't be programming. Actually, that's kind of my point. If HTML wasn't written as text, no one would call it a programming language. You can't define a programming language by wether or not it is written. Redstone in Minecraft is closer to a programming language than HTML.

I'm so sorry.

@awnumar hahaha I love PHP jokes

@hjk101 exactly, use the tools that you need and for the job you get paid for

He already has a chick so that's a 0 - 1 for him haha

@Olverine yes that makes a lot of things programming languages, a lot of things are by definition "objects" , doesn't make the definition wrong.

I think there is a legitimate argument that excel is a programming language. It may even be Turing complete I'm not sure.

@Hedgepig I can't say you're wrong since the definition of a programming language is open to interpretation. Just pointing out however that your definition is very vague.

@Olverine actually I thought it was pretty clear and specific. Broad for sure, not vague.

Language is a very broad definition.
Sure C is a very hard core programming language. But I'd rather use a nail gun than a hammer to put a roof on my house...

These damn CS elitist !

@Hedgepig the reason I say it's vague is because for me, it raises another question: how do we define "giving instructions to a computer"?

If a cat bumps a computer mouse, it has given instructions to a computer. Can we truthfully call that cat a programmer?

If someone passes a speed camera and gets photographed by it, can they call themselves a programmer.

If you answer yes to these questions, then your definition is clear and very broad. Otherwise, I would argue that it is either vague or flawed.

@Olverine in your camera example, wouldn't the person speeding be the (indirect) user, and who ever wrote the software that tells the camera to activate and take a picture be the programmer?

@Rudi yes but the user still (indirectly) instructed a task to execute on a computer. My point is, where do we draw the line? Is there even a line?

I am a C/C++ programmer, and am now learning JS, react-native and PHP. Its all the same shit. Fuck that snobby cunt.

@Olverine now not trying to sound like a smart ass but you're going a little reductio ad absurdum on me

https://logicallyfallacious.com/too...

@dauie I get the pride in coding stuff, what I don't get is why we aren't humble about it (hence the language-wars, OS-wars etc). If someone degrades PHP/JS, it's just a _language_, not a direct personal assault - which is how most people seem to react :-(

@Hedgepig Haha! Yeah I know, sorry! Just trying explain why I think you're being vague.

@Olverine I do see your point. I don't think it's worth too much energy debating for hours over a definition. People do get heated about it though!

No doubt I'll be replying to someone in a few days time who have been suddenly enraged by my comment

@Galrog

>++++++++[-<+++++++++>]<.>>+>-[+]++>++>+++[>[->+++<<+++>]<<]>-----.>-> +++..+++.>-.<<+[>[+>+]>>]<--------------.>>.+++.------.--------.>+.>+.

Also HTML+CSS is Turing complete

Okay, now I'm using reductio ad absurdum

A better rebuttal: source?

@Galrog I openly admitted the first point was a fallacy, my main point was that defining a programming language to be turing complete is a definition that has been plucked out of thin air, regardless of how much sense it makes. Unfortunatly I don't think its that simple. Programs can be made with languages that aren't turing complete.

If we are going to pin a definition, the one that makes most sense (and is recorded by most dictionaries) is a set of written instructions that controls the operations on a computer.

@Galrog sounds like a great idea! I'll definitely try that next time hahaha

there is a definition for what makes a programming language - has to do with the language being turing-complete