So I'm looking at the jobs available and the jobs I'm applying for and realizing that even though I'm never gonna use the 70+ languages (exaggeration) in daily work for any of these prospective employers, I'd better have those languages (and 5+ years of experience in each) just because HR is keyword happy about stuff they know nothing about.

So how do you manage to get 5+ years of experience in something you don't have 5+ years of experience in so that you can get a job where you don't actually need 5+ years of experience in those things anyway? Do I just hit up LinkedIn Learning and start grinding away on tutorials, then stick their "certifications" on my resume? For what purpose if it's stuff I can't get the needed experience in because I don't already have 5+ years of it?

How did I ever get a job in my field if, according to HR drones, I don't have any experience in what I'm doing now?

HR Buffoon: Hmm I see you have made outstanding contributions to these projects you have listed in your resume and a number of years of experience in a good variety of tech stacks but wait....you have MSSQL listed but no mySQL. We need more mySQL. Sorry!

@TeachMeCode I'm afraid this is exactly what's happening. I've kind of refrained from putting any languages on my résumé. Just projects, their outcomes, and various general skills. I know this hurts me on the algorithms but my theory is that it will prompt someone to actually, ya know, pick up the phone and CALL ME AND TALK TO ME LIKE HUMAN BEINGS USED TO DO! It's unbelievable how companies pretend to hire talented people. No wonder I keep reading article after article about companies complaining how hard it is to find qualified employees. Take HR out of the hiring loop and start having managers hire people directly. That's what I used to do and I got some of the BEST people that way.

Unfortunately not all those languages are exaggerated.

If I ever leave my current company, they'll need to find a Python Dev, a PHP dev, a Linux Sys Admin, a Java Dev, a DBA, a project lead, a Ruby Dev, fuck what else is there, a JS Dev, some one capable of dealing with powershell scripts, I can keep going but I'm sure you can see how this job ad would feel incorrect just reading it.

Some of us just don't care what language, framework, or OS that thing is built on anymore, it's just a few more lines of code to handle something else the business wants in whatever it was built with.

@C0D4 I agree 100%, especially that last paragraph. You're hired to solve problems and implement stuff that's useful for the business, the languages etc. are just details.

@stackodev what's the harm of listing languages etc. on your resume? Why be blocked from a perfectly fine job just because hiring these days tends to be keyword-screened more often than not? You (and the company) get all the "actual human evaluation" during the interview process, which usually does involve managers directly, which is why it still exists. So they're not losing out on anything, but you are.

@RememberMe They are, in fact, losing out. These are the companies that whine about "dev shortage", but don't realise that their incompetent HR and broken hiring process is a major reason why they can't find devs.

@Fast-Nop I would hardly think that's true in general, because even good companies use keyword screening - or its more advanced form, machine learning based mining of your resume. If nothing else it's used to filter spam resumes and applications.

Besides, I still don't see how it *hurts* you in any way to add keywords like languages and skills to your resume. It's like, a few lines at best, and also serves as a tl;dr for a human if they just want to see what you've used in the past at a glance. I fully believe in having actual fundamental tech skills rather than specific framework knowledge or whatever, but it's more data for the hiring folks.

The decision whether a company is good or not is better made with more data, rejecting them just because they look for keywords seems like a waste to me. That is, if you really need a job. If you have the luxury of shopping around for a place to work, sure, do whatever you want with the resume. Heck, do this (yes, it's a joke, but if you're behind something as successful as YOLO you don't really give a fuck, also, even this has keywords) https://pjreddie.com/resume/

woe, woe and doom

I’m gonna say you should at least list one language you’re good at, rather than none and just projects. As a hiring manager, I don’t know the depth of your input on those projects, but I know that If you know node or python and can build (or have built) something with those the rest is just syntax you can google. I don’t mind people googling syntax. Hell I don’t remember every option I have, but I do know that I need a for loop here to solve the problem (or lambda, etc). Yes it will help you get through the prescreens and it will help drive the interview.

I hire people without experience all the time; I look for gamers (logic skills), side projects, but yes all must have some experience with at least one language or I’m teaching it all and I don’t got that kinda time.

Most of these languages and frameworks can be learned quickly! They’re so damn easy to learn but no you need to have years of experience doing what? Why should you need years of experience to be proficient at let’s say React? Are people that slow?? It shouldn’t take that long to know React! I can say the same for other frameworks and languages! There are other things that will take time to learn! Best practices, design patterns and CS concepts are examples (yes CS is important, though deep CS theory with crazy math isn’t).

@TeachMeCode Unfortunately, I suffer with dyscalculia, which makes a lot of logic and math hard for me to process and solve as quickly as other people. There’s no official recognition of this as a disability that would qualify me for accommodations in the workplace, so I have to fudge my way through each and every day buying myself the time that I need to solve problems that most around me can do in short order. It sucks to the point that I sometimes consider quitting tech work altogether but then I’d have to start all over in something else.

@stackodev don’t worry, it looks like a lot of companies aren’t asking applicants to solve algorithm teasers as much as before during interviews. FANG companies still are but who needs them? There are tons of other great places that pay so much. Having a disability sucks, i have actual diagnosed ADHD and I was diagnosed by a psychiatrist (not ologist, but iatrist, someone who actually knows in detail about the piece of crap everyone has in their skulls) who also has ADHD (how he read medical textbooks is beyond me). But I think you’ll be fine, just describe what you’ve done in the past and sadly you may need to list your language expertise. Recruiter monkeys need their buzzword bananas

@TeachMeCode Thanks. I finally got hired by a company that doesn’t believe in FANG company-type coding tests. And they say they often do what I have to do: look stuff up on SO. I don’t know how anybody doesn’t. There is just so much to know about in so many languages, frameworks, build tools, etc. But apparently some people in various HR systems think that “being a coder” means you can just sit down and start typing out perfect code to solve any problem on your first try. Like they see in the movies.