Everybody keeps trying to get me to use cursor or GitHub copilot or some other LLM co-programmer that will shit all over my code

I DO NOT WANT YOUR SHITTY GENERATED CODE IN MY CODEBASE

I don't think I'll ever be sold on the utility of ai when the person is an expert in the subject. Basically, if you know what you're doing, there's no need to use it for that task.

That being said, there will be no escaping the direct effects of ai in the world to come, so it's important to be as much of an expert on it as possible. Being able to build and maintain ai systems will be a golden skill to have.

I'm convinced that the ultimate purpose of ai is to only ever be good enough to fill in where a person can't because there literally aren't people to put there. It will enable one person to fulfill the labor of 20 and that ultimately expertise in a subject will be seen as a luxury that can't be afforded.

I look at it like a seed vault, but instead of saving seeds, it's preserving, in some way, the ability to do things that will be lost if there's no one there to teach others how to do it.

ah, a non-believer

https://youtube.com/watch/...

Co-Pilot is awesome though. It wrote me almost a whole programming language and a bootloader (for an os) and a kernel and a linker and makefile to make it

Soon you'll start every project with generated code. I let it do css / html and then do the backend myself. Thanks to this stuff I finally have good looking projects because I'm no design talent myself. When it comes to generating code - it's good for generating the start of a project. The boiler plate stuff. You can also say thinks like create a form with these fields with validation or smth and it will just generate what you normally would but with more validation probably.

Hating om AI is so 2024.

What the guy above says is correct, it's better to learn to work with it. There'll come a time you can't avoid it anymore. Also, if your experiences with AI are old, really try again. They came a long way.

Idk, I always review llm's code to see how sound it is. Saves me from repeating boilerplate.

Also, the IntelliJ's in-editor ai-based autosuggestions are quite good more often than not

Boilerplate was solved by project templates and reusing code files, so I fail to see how useful that truly is. And you have to babysit everything it generates, so you may as well write it yourself and save the time. Using it for something you know how to do atrophies your skills and should be avoided.

It also enables people that don't know what they're doing to act like they do. Those are the tasks that ai is actually helpful with, because it's not meant to be an expert and can never be.

Imagine a world where you're a good programmer but an awful writer or botanist or doctor, but you have to be all of them because there's no writers or botanists or doctors. That's a world where ai will be unavoidable and not knowing how to use them or being unwilling to will be seen as a liability.

@cuddlyogre it's clear that you don't really tried it yet seriously. Also, AI is a especially a power tool in the hand of an expert more than in the hands of someone who doesn't know what he's doing. It will be overwhelming for someone that doesn't know what it's doing. The AI isn't there yet that complete donkies can write applications with it besides some scripts.

Today I worked on a very structured project so AI understood everything. * tab tab tab *. It made me work WAY faster for sure. Made a few models and mappers and then it understood exactly my way of declaring everything and only had to type the name of a model and it already would generate the fields in my style almost completely. Had to add / remove some fields but that's it. If I've had it done myself, it would've had at least some typo's. AI does it perfect at once. It' s still your code since you were about to write xactly that anyway. You have to do AI a lot and it gets better. Doesn't work directly.

@retoor Congratulations on participating with the ai to create something you don't understand and that no one understands.

Instead of spending a bit of time to build knowledge and skills and understanding, or use what you know to learn more, you jumped straight to the end and now no one knows what you've made and you'd never be able to do it again without the help of ai.

But like I said. That's what AI's purpose is. It's to enable people to act as if they know how to do something even though they don't. There will come a time where that is something we will have to do or what starve, but until then I would love if people would be honest with themselves and others and not claim they can do something they can't.

@cuddlyogre holy fuck, accusing me of not understanding what I'm doing is the biggest mistake you can make. I write most stuff in C for good understanding and I'm in the top 1% coders according to codeium in productivity of the freaking world. I wrote freaking interpreters and servers. Statistically the chance that you'll match me is kinda nothing. With your big mouth.

I'm done talking to you with your assumptions based on ignorance. Dude, you're not the only coder left in the world because you refuse to develop yourself. But for me, the most fun part is, is that within a YEAR or MAYBE two, you're just writing AI and thinking about what i've said. I assure you. Generative AI is there now for more than three years, how long can it take to adapt? And than considering that we programmers make fun of users that seem to be unable to learn something. Developers themselves are no hair better.

@retoor Not that I believe you, but I'll pretend that I do.

Were you doing this before without ai? Could you still do it without ai? If so, congrats. I bow to your hyper intelligence. That makes you a programmer and not the kind of person I was describing.

Can the same be said about almost anyone else that calls themselves a programmer just because they regurgitate something copilot generates for them?

No is the answer. And it's only going to get worse.

@cuddlyogre I use it just for almost a year and did more than 15 years without it professionally and studied it since six of eight. Also, I don't care if you believe it or not, you can just look it up. I use same username.

But I think that once autocompletion was approached the same way. And what did the ASM devs think when C came? Now everyone can dev. Same for python. With both C and Python an expert can do magic and makes still a true difference with a novice programmer. With an easy language the novice programmer shoots himself extra hard in the foot. With AI extremely hard. At a certain moment they have to do maintenance and they're fucked.

BTW, I only use generate for html/css and only use autocompletion. Besides that, I'm working the other way around, I don't download but upload my own code in a zip to gpt+ to discuss it. What about that 😁 I asked it to estimate how much users my slack alternative could handle based on used tech.