Unpopular Opinion: When Satya came to Microsoft leadership, Microsoft was a whole lot better company

Forget Windows and shit, Azure was the only open Microsoft on Ballmer days, then Satya, who were part of Azure decided to give the entire MSFT the Azure experience. Look where we are now

not saying Microsoft is no longer bad, its just more tolerable as a company now. Nice to see it backtracking and bracing stuff unlike its first leaderships

Even though I'm still very wary of how much Microsoft "loves" open-source relative to how much it just wants to better control it, but nevertheless I agree with you in the respect that it seems more tolerable now indeed...

I think MS only tries to be less of an asshole because they lost the power to do it, having failed on many fronts.

With things like TypeScript they are *actually* doing a great service to the open source and general dev community, though. I feel like they really changed for the better

@Fast-Nop MS bad reeeee

@caramelCase I feel a lotta people agree but they have their head so far up their ass with the MS hating to admit it.

I hate apple but what they did with gestures is 10/10 and I'm glad Android is tryna emulate that.

.Net Core should have never happened. It uses a bunch of hard to understand middleware. You need a lot of experience with it before you understand it at all. The docs are so weak. The good stuff from other .net like forms are completely gone. If you want to use good tools for it then you have to get Visual Studio which lacks a lot of the good parts of VS Code.

I have some MS guys on my team and they loooove it because it is sort of familiar. But then there are all of the problems with it that they stumble into. When I say let’s use another back end tech oh no it isn’t dotnet’s fault we just didn’t know. You didn’t know because it does a bunch of crazy stuff you can’t predict; if multiple developers with 10 years+ each of MS experience can’t predict the crazy antics then what hope do less familiar devs have? We could switch to something that doesn’t bury settings in middleware conventions. Something that doesn’t take 20 minutes for Jenkins to build.

@irene i wanna hear more about this because i have not hit this block on my hobby projects. Not saying this is not true, i am sure it has its faults and crazy shit since i still feel net core to be largely experimental. Just wanna know what sort of things to look into them in frustration.

What backend tech stacks would you prefer given the choice?

++ for Hanselman imo

@torbuntu @AleCx04 At scale we can have a real handful of turd on our hands.

Hobby stuff probably won’t be so bad. Where things get ugly is with database calls. Entity framework has a propensity for eager loading and other inefficient behaviours. Like if you want 100 records sorted in a particular way EF decides to select all records and return them to the API. Then EF sorts them, then pulls the first 100 off. All of that load is done outside of the database engine where it is less efficient. Your API slows down because you have too many records in your DB and it is doing a bunch of sorting. Retrieve a subset of that is all that is needed. The DB engine can do it way more efficiently.

Then there are some obscure middleware patterns that may or may not come with defaults that get set. Like there is a secret session timer that gets set to 20 minutes as default. You never gave it as a parameter or knew there was a timer in the class but it decided that 20 minutes is fine for your project. Then later down the line you are struggling with your session and can’t figure out why it is misbehaving. Turns out some classes did a bunch of undocumented behaviours. Oops I suppose you should inspect all of the source code of the middleware? BS

@Stuxnet I take it that you don't know shit about the historic track record of MS' business history.

@irene makes sense man. What would you prefer tho? I like hearing about the most painless options for backends :P

@AleCx04 lube.

@AleCx04 I make a lot of standalone microservice type things for a cloud environment so I like to use node.js and typescript. I occasionally use python + bottle/flask. Django seems to work well.

Most of the time I am stuck with dotnet core apps. I will take anything that does things in an explicit predictable way over an implied convention based approach.