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Haxk20442721yHold up there bud. Dont throw every girl in the same bag for some of them.
This is just management issue and not GirlsCanCode issue.
Im not a girl but think about it before saying something like this on internet.
I mean, I've seen tens of thousands of incompetent people not be fired for shipping shit code. They hide behind all sorts of excuses: language barrier, he's my bro, I'm hitting that, best intentions, bad requirements, misunderstood requirements. Last client I worked at had 300 Indian men fucking up constantly and taking months to deliver single files of CSS. They were the ones getting promoted.
But this is the thing that pisses you off 🤷♀️
kiki193471yWhen I opened this rant for the first time the app just crashed. That agenda shit again
kiki193471y@owenw this two picture comic made more for women rights than third wave ever did
molaram50141yjust a broad observation: fire a guy - its pretty much his fault so he promptly gets shit from everyone and their dog; fire a chick and everyone's like "omgwtf you fucking sexist pigs should be castrated"
I know @fast-nop will disagree with me, but not only girls do fuck up. Many people do. And what do we do when they fuck things up? Nooooo no no, we don't fire them - we make them learn from their mistakes and take measures so they don't happen again.
If they are incompetent - train them, couch them, grow them. If they are [objectively] hopeless in that area - find out their strengths and assign them to a spot that requires those skills rather than expect a fish to climb trees.
Noone's firing people immediately for underperformance. Noone's going to improve their performance if the only place you're telling about this is devRant. Raise the red flag to the leadership, to the management rather than go on hating quietly in your corner.
Why not just fire them and get someone in who is competent ?
I'm reminded of a place that hired an IT person, who knew nothing about IT at all, so they sent them on lots of training courses, which they just couldn't grasp.
In the end they gave them an IT related job to label everything in the building for stock control purposes. (The size of building is so large, they would never finish in their lifetime, we are talking 10's of square km in size..)
But it kept them out of the IT department where they couldn't break anything.
But it also kept anyone more competent out of a job !
When I went to management training classes, we was often given examples of what would you do if.
Most of the time my answer was 'Fire them!", whilst everyone else's answer was 'send them for training'.
There comes a time though when its obvious that someone is untrainable for a specific role and are best removed from the company instead.
Been there, same answer. Unfortunately, most business people care more about how it will reflect on their hiring effectiveness than how it will impact the product.
The only time I've ever successfully had that fly is myself and a colleague, uncolluded, both went to the manager with the same complaint. Tech interview was remote and it had become fairly obvious the guy we got was not the person we interviewed and the recruitment firm had screwed us with a staged interview, and management for some reason didn't want us in the in-person interview.
So, takeaway, if you want to fire someone for incompetence, gang up on them individually. And don't let business people have final say on engineering hires.
Of course everyone can be incompetent. I've witnessed stupid men, too. No shit. Like all the ranters here who already fail at tagging a dumb joke/meme as such.
But the issue with useless diversity hires is that they were not hired to do actual work in the first place. They didn't pass coding or whatever tests. They're just dead weight in the team, and that was clear the moment they were hired.
Now, is that actually because of quotas here? The OP didn't state that, so we don't know. Maybe it's just accidental hiring of morons. But these days, quotas do exist in many places, unfortunately.
And that's why diversity quotas, including women quotas, are damaging the reputation and make shit harder for competent women who have never needed nor wanted quotas.
@Nanos because you've already made an investment [the hiring process] and you made your call based on your super-duper flawless hiring process [interviews and everything].
However, if your hiring process is flawed, who's to say your next hire will be any better?
I'm always siding with those who give the poor fellow a second chance, then find out what the problem is and try and help him get up to the pace if the knowledge gap is not that big [if it's possible to make him worthy in, say, a month or two (getting a new hire might take longer than that.. And is risky - you never know how well motivated, how much more/less competent he'll be)]. However, if the fellow is indeed in wrong shoes - try and find the right ones for him. Assuming he wants to stay in the company and is willing to switch to some more suitable role ofc :)
motivation and will are no less important than skills required for the job imo. And the former two can sometimes outweight the latter one in the beginning, boosting it up as time goes
Hazarth39571yYeah, to sum it up:
1: You're correct, they should be fired, or at least get a talk with management about performance, because it shouldn't matter what gender you are in programming as long as you do your job properly
2. You're wrong, its not a GirlsCanCode issue, because there are just as many good female programmers as there are male programmers, I've worked with both, and there's good and bad apples in both groups, it just so happens that there's not as many women in our field (sadly)
And can you blame them? Who'd want to work in a field where you either:
a) get special treatment for being born as a women, which tbh I think is fucking insulting to the actually intelligent programmer women.
or b) get generalized and labeled as "girl coder" with the implications that you're inherently bad at what you do because of who you are.
and really force hiring women because of quotas isn't helping improve this view. Just treat your fellow programmers as humans, not M/F