I hate this fucking front-end stuff so hard..

How DA FUCK is it possible that I set up the whole backend including DB connection, base controllers, models, base validation and stuff in an hour but don't get this fucking fucking retarded JS framework piece of shit to display a test string after ONE FUCKING HOUR!!!

Why do we need this shit anyway? Why does everything have to be shiny with some fucking animations???

It's about the information, isn't it? Then WHY DOES IT HAVE TO LOOK PRETTY???

I gonna travel back in fucking time to the early 80's!

Stupid front-end shit..

Well, the user only sees the frontend, so it must be pretty. Developers, at least most of them, don't give a shit about the UI.

I usually use the terminal - so I don't care about the UI :)

I love the UI. My philosophy is that the things we use should be pleasing to look at.
And I'm a Dev, I know, a minority. I have to deal with this "who cares what it looks like" shit every day

You ask why and use a js framework... THAT IS WHY 😂

@karma because I have to. But I don't see the benefit of having it.

@just8littleByte, out of curiosity, what JS framework were you having trouble with?

@just8littleByte there is no benefit, it is a framework

@KingDorito angular. I know it's actually pretty straight forward. But I'm not used to the way of thinking that the controller might have the wrong name when it tells me that the module doesn't exist..😪

@karma not sure if you #include "ironic" or not..?

@just8littleByte, oh haha. dont worry about it. it toke me at least 2 days to get it all nutted out.

@just8littleByte npm install irony

@Froot @Froot What I meant was that a developer can handle a fucking UI. The normal user would be immediately overwhelmed.

btw: I also like well done UIs (e. g. VSCode), but it wouldn't be a problem for me if it would look like Emacs.

Software products, and I guess technology in general today are about not only delivering functionality, but a positive experience.

Though seriously, when a web app becomes sufficiently complex, vanilla CSS/JS just doesn't cut it. All the manual, minute logic involving DOM manipulations leads to bloated, messy code.

Angular is fucking terrible, man. Dependency injection is cancer.

++'d for the tags

@tracktraps Well here we differ. Emacs is fucking ugly, straight out of the 80s. If my job has me looking at an editor for 8h a day then I want that editor or IDE to look good.

@Froot good looks fade away, lack of good functionality doesn't

@Hedgepig I wouldn't say it fades away but I get your point. Of course the functionality has to be there, no doubt about it. But the design has to as well

@Froot I will prioritise an ugly editor that will make my job faster and easier over a stunning editor that will do the comparative opposite every time.

@Hedgepig Well good design does include ease of use. So well designed products should be easier to use than poorly designed ones

@devios1
You refer to angularJS or 2/4? Why do you think that (Both statements)?

@Froot I agree though one can't rival the speed and power of emacs and vim in many areas

@Froot I have to disagree. A good design does not imply easy usage. Do not misinterpret UX as UI. These are two different things.

I would call Visual Studio (not VSCode) a well-designed program, but it's hard to handle. VSCode, on the other hand, looks better and is easier to use. Which of these would be better if they both had the same functionality?

@tracktraps UI and UX are not exactly different things. I would say UI is a subset of the bigger umbrella of UX. But the interface is most definitely a part of the overall experience, and arguably the most important part.

It is a fallacy to believe that simpler design necessarily means less capability. Indeed often much of what complicates the UI of an app is necessary only because of the poor design of that app.

I'd like to quote Alan Perlis. He was speaking of programming languages, but the same could be said for an IDE:

"A programming language is low level when its programs require attention to the irrelevant."

Extrapolating from that, if a program is easy to use, it is easy to use because it does not cater to the irrelevant implementation details that come about from a poor design, and thus ease of use is absolutely part of the design.