So... I just remembered a story that's perfect for devrant.

My brother got into engineering in university, and during the second semester they had their introductory class to programming. They had weekly homeworks that the lecturer would check and give grades accordingly.

The factors that could influence the grading were: execution (meaning that the code would excecute as intended), efficiency and readabilty. The weeks passed and everyone was doing well, getting fairly good grades. Everyone was happy.

Until one day a random guy we'll call bob got the worst grade possible. Bob wasn't a bad student. He had over-the-average grades in all the weekly homeworks and even impressed the professor in some. Naturally, he was baffled when he saw his grade on the google spreadsheet. He was pretty sure his code ran well. He always tested it on different machines and OSs. So, at the end of the class, he went straight to the helper of the class, in a pretty imperative manner, to demand to know how the fuck he got that grade. It's impossible he got excecution, efficiency and readabilty, wrong. All three wrong? Impossible. Even the stupidiest kid in the class had some points on readabilty.

"Oh, so you are Bob. Huh?" said the helper in a laid-back attitude. "Come with me. Prof. X is waiting for you in his office."

This got Bob even more confused. As they approached the office, the courage he had in a first moment banished and gave way for nervousness and fear.

The helper nocks the door. "Prof., Bobs here"

As soon as Bob sits in the chair in front of Prof. X's, he knew something bad was coming.
"In all these years of teaching..." said Prof. X hesitantly. "In all these years of teaching I have not come even close to see something similar to what you've done. You should be ashamed of yourself." Needless to say, Bob was panicked.

"In all these years I have not seen such blatant mockery!" added the professor. "HOW THE FUCK DID YOU EVEN DARE TO SEND A HOMEWORK WITH SUCH VARIABLE NAMING" That's when Bob realised the huge mistake he made. "NEVER IN ALL THESE YEARS I HAVE SEEN SOMEONE NAME HIS VARIABLES *opens the file on his desktop *: PENIS, SHIT, FUCKSHIT, GAYFUCKING<insert Prof. X's name>MAN, GOATSE, VAGINAVAR, CUMFUNCTION, [...]" The list of obcenities went on and on. In each word, the professor hit the table harder than the last time.

Turns out Bob felt so in comfort with the ease of the course he decided to spice things up by using "funny naming conventions" while coding, and then tidying everything up before uploading the homework. This week he forgot, and fucked it big time.

So remember folks, always check your code before committing/giving it in/production. And always adhere to naming conventions.

Let the student use their own laptops. Even buy them one instead of having computers on site that no one uses for coding but only for some multiple choice tests and to browse Facebook.

Teach them 10 finger typing. (Don't be too strict and allow for personal preferences.)

Teach them text navigation and editing shortcuts. They should be able to scroll per page, jump to the beginning or end of the line or jump word by word. (I am not talking vi bindings or emacs magic.) And no, key repeat is an antifeature.

Teach them VCS before their first group assignment. Let's be honest, VCS means git nowadays. Yet teach them git != GitHub.

Teach git through the command line. They are allowed to use a gui once they aren't afraid to resolve a merge conflict or to rebase their feature branch against master. Just committing and pushing is not enough.

Teach them test-driven development ASAP. You can even give them assignments with a codebase of failing tests and their job is to make them pass in the beginning. Later require them to write tests themselves.

Don't teach the language, teach concepts. (No, if else and for loops aren't concepts you god-damn amateur! That's just syntax!)

When teaching object oriented programming, I'd smack you if do inane examples with vehicles, cars, bikes and a Mercedes Benz. Or animal, cat and dog for that matter. (I came from a self-taught imperative background. Those examples obfuscate more than they help.) Also, inheritance is overrated in oop teachings.

Functional programming concepts should be taught earlier as its concepts of avoiding side effects and pure functions can benefit even oop code bases. (Also great way to introduce testing, as pure functions take certain inputs and produce one output.)

Focus on one language in the beginning, it need not be Java, but don't confuse students with Java, Python and Ruby in their first year. (Bonus point if the language supports both oop and functional programming.)

And for the love of gawd: let them have a strictly typed language. Why would you teach with JavaScript!?

Use industry standards. Notepad, atom and eclipse might be open source and free; yet JetBrains community editions still best them.

For grades, don't your dare demand for them to write code on paper. (Pseudocode is fine.)

Don't let your students play compiler in their heads. It's not their job to know exactly what exception will be thrown by your contrived example. That's the compilers job to complain about. Rather teach them how to find solutions to these errors.

Teach them advanced google searches.

Teach them how to write a issue for a library on GitHub and similar sites.

Teach them how to ask a good stackoverflow question :>

I started at a company to develop an "uber" clone. Hired by the company's cto. I was happy initially as i had been unemployed for a while but that's because i didn't see the shitstorm coming. The task was build this using php, well 2 weeks later and db locking issues because mysql only allows 100 connections and the website takes over 200mb per request, i tried using the meteor framework, a lil better but the orphaned process would require me to reboot every 2 days. So enter erlang, built in 3 weeks works amazing problems none here... Well in comes the cto (which came in once a week). Apparently he had been reviewing my code and didn't understand it. He couldn't understand no for loops etc and demanded that it be made understandable to a normal dev. Did normal devs write uber no. Anyhow i spent the next 6 Weeks refactoring trying to make elixir looks like imperative programming, he finally gave up, so now I'm deep committed writing an API, finish in a week cto comes in and "why aren't you using patch" i don't need it, well another day implanting a patch api that will never be used. Ok done. Now we have a meeting with the investors who i worked in the same building with and they want a frontend built. I explained i was a backend dev and they needed a uiux expert. Next week cto comes back with this jquery fire pit and stolen bootstrap theme and take me with implementing it. This time we scrap the api change some of the backend logic and implement rest from the 90s one static page per request. After 3 months working with jquery I'm let go because of finical issues. I told them i was a backend dev but they didn't listen if the cto would've gotten a frontend expert things would be different but what to expect from a cto who's coding legacy is creating WordPress plugins.

Hopefully things will be better soon I'm tired of living on the streets.

the more time I spend in this industry, the more I come to realize that it's a very blurry line between PROGRAMMING and CONFIGURING.

How much programming do you do these days, really? Isn't it just configuring your frameworks and libraries and engines to do what they do in the way you want?

Does it still make you programmers...?

And then what are these .conf files for your application? A declarative configuration for your... imperative configuration...?

Imperative programming: why do you have to make our lives so difficult?

When are people going to understand that programming is not about quickly putting something together?

Programming may have its utility in helping us out building solutions, but that's a secondary function of it.
Ultimately and abstractly, as MIT professors said, it's about the imperative paradigm of solving problems.

I really dislike it when people treat programming as if it were a toolbox. It is a great engineering feat. That's like saying math is just about numbers. No, it is about concepts. We're thinkers, not doers.

Why is it that virtually all new languages in the last 25 years or so have a C-like syntax?

- Java wanted to sort-of knock off C++.
- C# wanted to be Java but on Microsoft's proprietary stack instead of SUN's (now Oracle's).
- Several other languages such as Vala, Scala, Swift, etc. do only careful evolution, seemingly so as to not alienate the devs used to previous C-like languages.
- Not to speak of everyone's favourite enemy, JavaScript…
- Then there is ReasonML which is basically an alternate, more C-like, syntax for OCaml, and is then compiled to JavaScript.

Now we're slowly arriving at the meat of this rant: back when I started university, the first semester programming lecture used Scheme, and provided a fine introduction to (functional) programming. Scheme, like other variants of Lisp, is a fine language, very flexible, code is data, data is code, but you get somewhat lost in a sea of parentheses, probably worse than the C-like languages' salad of curly braces. But it was a refreshing change from the likes of C, C++, and Java in terms of approach.

But the real enlightenment came when I read through Okasaki's paper on purely functional data structures. The author uses Standard ML in the paper, and after the initial shock (because it's different than most everything else I had seen), and getting used to the notation, I loved the crisp clarity it brings with almost no ceremony at all!

After looking around a bit, I found that nobody seems to use SML anymore, but there are viable alternatives, depending on your taste:

- Pragmatic programmers can use OCaml, which has immutability by default, and tries to guide the programmer to a functional programming mindset, but can accommodate imperative constructs easily when necessary.
- F# was born as OCaml on .NET but has now evolved into its own great thing with many upsides and very few downsides; I recommend every C# developer should give it a try.
- Somewhat more extreme is Haskell, with its ideology of pure functions and lazy evaluation that makes introducing side effects, I/O, and other imperative constructs rather a pain in the arse, and not quite my piece of cake, but learning it can still help you be a better programmer in whatever language you use on a day-to-day basis.

Anyway, the point is that after working with several of these languages developed out of the original Meta Language, it baffles me how anyone can be happy being a curly-braces-language developer without craving something more succinct and to-the-point. Especially when it comes to JavaScript: all the above mentioned ML-like languages can be compiled to JavaScript, so developing directly in JavaScript should hardly be a necessity.

Obviously these curly-braces languages will still be needed for a long time coming, legacy systems and all—just look at COBOL—, but my point stands.

!rant

so the other day i was programming and suddenly i wanted to learn haskell. (i don't know why it hit me so suddenly, maybe because it's a 'pure' functional programming language and these 2 terms i knew nothing about)

and to be honest it's really hard coming from an imperative programming language (C/C++, yes, i know they are different in their ways). it's like learning to program again! you really have to get a different mindset and for me honestly it's hard to grasp the idea that 'variables' are immutable! like, that's soooo weird it still stucks to me. for example how did they define the max or min function without using a while loop? what are monads?

I am just 2 days in but it'll be a fun ride!

If you're subscribed to me only because of my jokes, feel free to ignore this rant. You won't miss anything.

If not, bear with me.

I was wrong about almost everything I can remember. Preaching so-called “conceptual thinking”, I invented a fantasy world of random anecdotes, which turned into a completely false worldview that shaped my reality. I bashed magical thinking, yet succumbed to it. What I believed to be true was just as magical, wrapped into what sounded like science. In the Dunning-Krueger scheme, I was right there on Peak Stupid.

Random hear-say, stupid concepts I invented, random “knowledge” I picked from YouTube videos, all that was rotting inside my head, one anecdote contradicting another. Ultimately, I think this was the reason of my constant anxiety and pointless, never-ending thought process in background.

If you learned anything factual from me and didn't fact-check it, please forget that immediately. The list includes but is not limited to everything on brain structure, everything on philosophy, almost everything on engineering and architecture, almost everything on systems theory and programming meta stuff (declarative, imperative, etc.)

I admit bashing unit tests. The only reason was me disliking writing them in uni. I wrote like three test cases, disliked it, and the rest was history. Everything else was a rationalization on top. If I was right about something, I was just lucky.

I'm not a CSS prodigy. I know stuff that earns me money and impresses my colleagues, but my knowledge is just one step above basics, in one thousand steps ladder.

One of biggest epiphanies came through this fundamental critique in SICP of the assignment operator. Through years of imperative programming it seems so innocent, doesn't it? But that you lose referential transparency, run into the alias problem and fundamental difficulty to determine object equality (or of their instances) - that was kind of eye opening considering all the pain I had already experienced with state in concurrency.
(It led me so far to think it's an ontological issue, that even in the discrete computing universe we have not come so much further than Zenon's paradoxa on change.)

Ban visual programming programs, like scratch after the fist month introduce them to enhanced Google search strings and let them code on the command line going from imperative, over functional to object oriented programming styles using languages suited for the current style. Not like using Java from the get go. I hated it, waiting until everyone got to the point where they kind of understood the logic but failed at using correct syntax and efficient coding styles.

Functional programming instead of imperative

Object Orientation is not a feature, it is an unneeded layer of complexity over a dying paradigm, Imperative Programming

I started making a library to get to know TypeScript. 4 days into the commits and I don't know if I made the best choice or the worst choice. I MEAN WHY CLASSES!! JAVASCRIPT IS MORE A FUCNTIONAL PROGRAMMING LANGUAGE THAN AN IMPERATIVE PROGRAMMING LANGUAGE! I DONT WANT TO NEW UP! I DONT WANT THE DEVELOPERS TO NEW UP! WHERE ARE THE DESIGN PATTERNS! I CANT FUCKING FIND IT!!

Do you guys know a cool language to get a bit more into functional programming?
Doesn't matter if purely functional or a mashup of functional and imperative programming.
And please a real-world language, let Haskell stay in its Ivory-tower where it belongs.

My apologize to everyone I told that functional programming is declarative.

It's actually imperative. Thank you @AndSoWeCode for figuring that out. I spent the whole day thinking about it.

Lisp is imperative. It's just different way to define the exact data transformations, and that's quite imperative.

On the other hand, HTML, CSS, config files and markup languages are declarative.

But writing the imperative program which is configured with declarative configs seems like great idea. Consider Apache web server and others.

Anyone here using the Nim programming language? I just started today and want to see how others feel about it and if anyone may be interested in collaborating on a project.

Functional-Declarative languages should only be esoteric ones. They are interesting for research and a mathematical toy, but they should not be used for programming languages used in the real world.

I currently try to write OpenSCAD code that places a list of modules, with information given from an array, with varying sizes next to each other. And is so hard and cumbersome. Whoever had the idea to cripple OpenSCAD by not having variables was stupid or sadistic.

The actual CPU run instructions, one after the other, there is no good reason to not allow some imperative elements in a programming language.

Day one as a teaching assistant in Imperative Programming. Wish me luck

React, it's declarative way of doing things, and the functional programming methodology it prefers.

Realized how much I've moved on from for-loops and class/object instance to maps, filters and immutability/observers when I worked on a Laravel project after so long and found myself forced to do things in the, erm, "PHP" way, despite spending my initial year and a half of programming working exclusively in PHP.

Sure, there's Class Components and imperative techniques in React but I had blissfully settled into using the flexible nature of doing things enabled by both native JS and React, with hooks, Lodash/Ramda and (almost fanatically) pure functions

Trees -> declarative programming

Loops -> functional programming

Sequences -> imperative programming

Graphs -> dynamic programming

Good mapping, yeah or no?

val true : bool = isFrustrated(me : Human)

1) Honestly fuck SML. Who's goddamn idea was it to make a useless fucking programming language that does absolutely nothing relevant unless you're trying to learn recursion. Who's fucking idea was it to not be able to even have side effects. And who gives a shit if you can explicitly declare the type of variables on every single fucking line that's what comments are for if you really need it. All this is aside from the fact that nobody ever has been like "OH UNMUTABLE TYPES? WOW IM SO HAPPY THIS IS SO USEFUL". At this point I feel like SML is basically a DFA - ABSOLUTELY FUCKING USELESS

2) Aside from that, who's idea was it to duplicate two classes. There's 15-122 (Principles of Imperative Computation) and 15-150 (Principles of Functional Programming). So far the ONLY fucking thing different is we learned about work and span in 15-150 - OTHER THAN THAT ITS LIKE TAKING THE EXACT SAME COURSE. BUT AGAIN. So then I have to fucking sit in lecture and pay attention for that tiny bit of information that is new amongst the giant cesspool of information that isn't. BECAUSE I ALREADY LEARNED IT.
Oh and did I mention that both classes are required to graduate as a CS major? Fuck me.

Thanks devRant for helping <3

Edit: We are 4 weeks into the semester so you'd expect we'd have gotten into the new stuff by now right????

What's the easiest functional programming language for someone with experience with imperative languages?

I would like to learn a functional language to broaden my horizons. I have knowledge of Python and C / C ++ and I want the language to be easy to learn from someone who comes from the imperative realm of languages. I don't care if the language is strong enough. I just need a language to learn the basics of a functional programming language, and then I'll try to find a more complex (and powerful) one.

thank

FP features in OO/Imperative languages are more Data Oriented Programming (DOP) features than FP. Clojure popularised the term and now every FP language is trying to say “oooh FP is mainstream now”.

No its not. Nobody really cares if you managed to create this beautiful effect system that can emulate what OOP does for decades now. What people care is making data transformations simple and flat.

While programming is imperative (how to x) rather than declarative (x = y) (mathematics), it deceives me from the idea that I won't have to touch a lot of math.

To my dismay, I now realize that in order for the imperative process to be correct, I have to do immense amounts of declarative thinking (algorithms, proofs,..). That which is written has to work.