I fucking love people like this.

Yesterday I met a 'friend' who I hadn't seen in a very long time. Just a guy I used to know tbh but let's call him Friend anyway. After a while in the conversation this happened...

*Friend doesn't know I have a degree in CS*

Friend: "WHAT?? YOU LIKE PROGRAMMING? NO WAY! ME TOO!"

Me: "THAT'S AWESOME! You've been programming for long?"

Friend: "A little over a year now. I know almost all languages now. C++, C#, Python, Java and HTML. Still a couple left to go. Once you're on the level I achieved programming becomes really, really easy. How long have you been programming?"

Me: "Almost a decade now"

Friend: "Damn dude you must know all languages by now I suppose?"

Me: "I've been mainly doing C++ so not really haha"

Friend: "I can always help when you're struggling with one language. C++ is pretty easy tbh. You should learn others too btw. HTML for example is pretty important because you can program websites with it"

Me: "Yeah... Thanks... So... What project are you working on right now?"

Friend: "I'm making a register page for my very own forum. The only problem I have is that PHP won't save the login details"

Me: "Hahaha I know the feeling. MySQL?"

Friend: "What?"

Me: "What do you use to save your data"

Friend: "Just a txt file. It's easier that way."

Me: "Hahaha true. Who needs safety right? *smiles*"

Friend: "Actually it's 100% safe because only I can see the txt file so other people can not hack other users."

Me: "Yes! That's great! Cya!"

Friend: "I'm working on a mmorpg too btw! I can learn you to make games if you want. Just call me. Here's my number"

Me: "Alright... Thanks... Bye!"

*Arrives at home*

*Deletes number*

I do not make this up.

I can understand that someone who isn't in the CS industry doesn't take it too seriously and gets hyped when their "Hello World" program works.
I'm fine with that.

The thing that really triggers me is big headed ass holes like this. Like how much more like a absolute dickhead could you possibly more act? Fucking hate people like that.

I am done with people, I just want one single room, with good internet, dual monitor setup... And I can spend my whole life like that... Being social, fuck that shit... I have devRant for that... and rest, I just want to code, listen to music, drink coffee and sleep like hell...

Why is it that I can understand some other dev's code faster that understanding someone's feelings. Why is it that I am good with principles of Programming Languages, but not the basic Principles of Humanity... Yes, I agree I don't have feelings, but is it wrong not to have feelings, I am a dev, I am supposed to be good with Codes, not humans... I want to be in my small space of close people. (My family), and that's it... I am no good with others. I hate Facebook, but love devRant, I spend more time on StackOverflow than that on WhatsApp. Why is it so... Why

Languages without a fully implemented type system.

Granted, it has been a fad for a quarter century, but everything points at one simple fact: Types matter in programming.

In dynamic languages, you tend to see that testing suites explode into thousands of tests, many of which wouldn't even be necessary if you had some type safety.

You see that languages like JS are forked into more typesafe dialects, like Typescript. Python got typehints since 3.6, and PHP added typehints for methods, then typehints for properties, and will soon even have compound types.

Maybe most languages will never reach the level of Haskell or Scala, and that's totally fine, but I think the direction languages are moving in is pretty much set in stone: No ambiguity, more safety. Code should fail before deploying, not after.

Having PHP as my most useful skill.

I know various other languages, but they're either too exotic for professional use, or my knowledge about them doesn't have the same depth as with PHP.

People joke about how awful PHP is, and it's not entirely true. The incongruous stuff such as confusing parameter ordering can be fixed with libraries. And PHP7 fixed a lot of the ugly stuff. A good dev can certainly write structured, readable, performant PHP code.

But there is a real hard limit. PHP is missing more complex type definitions present in other languages. A weak type system is like building stuff with popsicle sticks and bits of duct tape, it works fast and perfectly fine for small projects, but the lack of strictness is a problem when you have thousands of classes intertwined in all kinds of complex factory, service and repository patterns. And the simple type hints are still newish and fully optional, which means a lot of people don't use them.

So I regret getting stuck in this self reinforcing loop, where I learn more about a very imperfect language through employment, and keep rolling into jobs using that skill because it's what I'm most experienced with.

Python -> indentation
HTML -> <!doctype HTML>
C++. -> int main()
PHP. -> <?php ?>

These are the fundamentals for some popular languages. Than there is this;

Lisp. -> ()

Like it doesn't give a fuck.
Not a single one.
I like that.

Sometimes I feel I'm an app developer, a web developer, a sysadmin, an ethical hacker and a programmer who's comfortable in several languages. At other times, I feel like I just know how to use the internet.

So, I was out cruising in my sports car the other day. Porsche, two seater, about 400 hp.

When I stopped at a red light I was next to a man driving his family of four in his Volkswagen. I revved my car to show my power, but he seemed unfazed by my superior engine. When the light became green I floored it, he didn't have a chance of catching up, I just left him behind and laughed. He's so stupid for driving that slow car.

I can't understand why anyone would ever want to drive a Volkswagen when they are just so obviously slow?

👆This is how you sound like when you compare languages only based on how fast they are.

Friend: dude, JavaScript seems awesome. It looks so easy and there aren't any annoying compiler errors like in Java

Me: I know it sounds cool in theory, but it sucks in practice, trust me

Friend: no way, dynamically typed languages are the future

*Friend installs node*
*Friend writes a simple script*
*Friend gets undefined errors because of a few typos and has a hard time debugging it*

Friend: JavaScript is retarded

-_-

I don't understand why people tend to shit on certain languages.
I`ve seen my fair share of shit software written in a plethora of languages, and the problem was usually that the devs used the language/framework completely wrong.
Languages and frameworks are designed to solve problems, if you don`t use them in the correct way then you are to blame.

It is like sticking your dick in the exhaust pipe of a Volvo, and then writing a Medium post complaining about your charred dick and how all Volvo's suck. Yeah I'm talking about you PHP haters, all of you that shit on Java on a daily basis and you morons saying "python is slow"

Don't get me wrong, I send PHP shitposts/memes all day to my friends working with it. But if my code doesn't work, it is my fault and I own up to it.

With that said, I will blow my brains out before writing a single line more of PHP

Rant over

I do not understand the people that say that they hate C-like languages, because of the ; and {} they have, that are "confusing".
Like almost every modern IDE/editor pinpoints EXACTLY where you forgot something...

Books and command lines.

I don't like teachers.

I think it's because my learning process is very async and chaotic. When I see a snippet in Golang, I relate it to PHP, Rust and Haskell. I jump to resolving the problem in other languages, trying to find out which approaches work in Go.

Then I read about some computer science concept on Wikipedia and get lost in that while my hunger for knowledge and food increases. After a while I look up a recipe for a pasta salad, and while cutting bell peppers, I see the recipe in terms of typed morphisms, I sprinkle and intersperse ingredients through mapping functions, then decide to write an interpreter for the esoteric "Chef" language in Go so I can interpret my salad recipe while eating it.

Voila, I'm learning Go.

I have no patience for linear mentoring, and others have no patience for mentoring me.

But that's OK.

STOP SHITTING ON PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES.
Now, I'm not talking to the people that don't take it too serious, but rather to people that think their language is superior and others inferior. Why shit on PHP? A lot of stuff is build with this, including devRant. For me, I'd love to learn any languages that has a proper use for me. (With this sentence I'm excluding all exoteric languages, because they are useless) If anyone says, Python is awesome as fuck, yeah, I FUCKING AGREE. Anyone telling me anything is crap, I disagree. If it's that terrible, how do you know about it? If it was never used ever in a project, how can you know its terrible? You can't. Unless you coded that thing yourself.

Next time don't waste your time on shit like that. I AM ALSO LOOKING AT THE HOLY WAR APPLE VS MICROSOFT VS LINUX

STOP WASTING YOUR TIME WITH SHIT LIKE THIS.

Unpopular dev opinion:

I like ending lines of code with semicolons. It helps add structure and organization. My code feels naked without them. After learning to code in JavaScript and Java, it's force of habit to put them, and python's lack of them is one of the reasons I hate it's syntax

Maybe I'm old fashioned. All the hipster languages either make semicolons optional or usually actively discourage them

Idk I like them though

One day at a doctor who started a small conversation:
Doc: What is your job?
Me: I am a software developer, I write computer programs basically.
Doc: Interesting. How does it work?
Me: Oversimplified you have special languages to tell the computer what to do and then this is converted into a program you can start on your PC. The languages are a bit like basic english (thought of Pascal at this moment).
Doc: So then it is a pretty simple job.

Me thinking: OMFG yes that's why I studied it 6 years, because it's soo easy.

Me thinking at home: Next time tell them that you are a computer scientist and that it is applied mathematics basically. Maybe then they will get a clue of the complexity. 🤔

"Hey I am a programmer too! I can code anything, I bet I'm better than you!"
-
"Huh, that sounds cool! What languages do you like to write your programs in?"
-
............ "English"

🤦🏻‍♂🤦🏻‍♂
True story by the way, some guy I just met did this. I was not sure how to react. Should I laugh? Should I cry? Should I kill myself? Should I kill him?

That just takes the damn fun out of it.

"In Python, we don't actually use commas unlike many languages. And as I mentioned last time, a tuple is a lot like a list, but it has it's differences. Oh yeeeah! Did I mention the logic behind if/else if/ and else statements?? They're sooo amazing."

I'm real tired of my coworkers always trying to one up me and being elitist about their code. Like I get it, you think PHP is shit, C is so much better than Java. Wow, you must be so knowledgeable! /s

Just because you're bashing on bad languages and talking shit doesn't mean you write good code, and in fact your code isn't top quality, I've read it. All you're going to accomplish with an elitist mindset is close yourself off to improving, and that's probably the worst thing you can do as a developer.

How can you tell if someone's a node.js coder?
Don't worry they'll tell you.

What do I dislike about node.js?
The fanboys.
Seriously you guys need to chill out. Your language is not the end of all other languages. It isn't going to replace PHP or Python or Ruby. It's not going to be the only thing around in 4 years.
I'm not a fan of JavaScript, I just don't like the language. I don't care about all the advantages and the other bs you're shouting about. If I want that feature I'm sure I can find a way to get it in my language.
Now shoo fly you're bothering me

Am I being completely ignorant? I like to think of programming like construction (worked for 9 years in that industry) when I learn a new language I approach it the same way as using a new tool. I don't feel like I'm learning a new "trade", just a new way to do the same things i already know how to do using a different method. I feel like a lot of programmers have trouble picking up new languages/frameworks because the THINK it is completely new...where as learn a new TRADE (devops, database arch, design etc) is something completely new/different

Recruiter: You cought my attention because of your positive profile. And my client is looking for someone with your profile. Attachment: java_developer.pdf

Me: What exactly did you like about my profile? I can tell by the filename that the company is looking for java developers. Which is neither what I can do nor what I am willing to do.

Recruiter: This isn't clear by your profile, what do you want to do?

Me: Me profile has exactly two programming languages, JavaScript and Objective C.

From the guy who wrote all the Programming Microsoft books and the Annotated Turing book. Comes this book.

This book is great for beginners great for people who don’t know a lot about software and how computers work, simple read. I like it because it also gives a different prospective, beginning at Morse code and works up from there all the way up to high level languages.

The book gives snippets of code to discuss it not really a tutorial book. It’s a different type of book that all people could understand.

Good read

I really hate it when online sources aimed at educating people looking to get into programming attack specific languages. I'm ok with them recommending some good starting languages (ex. JavaScript, Python, etc.) but I find it extremely inappropriate and damaging when they list languages they consider "bad." Languages like JavaScript, PHP and Java constantly get called out even though they power a huge chunk of the web and services hundreds of millions of people use every day. IMO it's a huge disservice to tell beginners not to even look at these languages. We should be teaching the language isn't really what's important - it's what you build with it.

Been reading devRant for a while now and I have to say I'm sad about the way the future of the software engineering looks like. Everyone seems to have a lot of hatred towards certain techniques and/or platforms and sad to say, but you are missing a lot.

I have been in the biz for around 15 years and have worked on Win, Linux, Mac, Unix, Symbian, Embedded etc. using all sorts of tools and languages and I must say it has taught me a lot and given diversity on my career and I hope you could also open your mind and start educating yourselves. Theres a world behind your bubble!

Peace and love!

So, a friend of mine just called me and asked what is it that I do in programming, and if I knew Java, because her stepfather owns a company, and they're currently hiring. Since she's not a tech person, I answered "basically, websites", but the stepfather was asking something else in the background, and she couldn't understand what the heck he was saying, so she put me on the phone with him.
I then explained, I do all kinds of web related stuff, from simple HTML single page sites, to WordPress themes and whatever, so I know PHP, Javascript, and all that crap.
And then, he asks me this wonderful question:
"And programming languages... ?", as in "do you know any?"
... I was like... Wut?...
I mean, I see where he's coming from. He probably meant compiled languages or something, but still... I felt like screaming at him "WEB DEVELOPERS ARE REAL PROGRAMMERS AND DESERVE SOME LOVE TOO YOU KNOW?! 😢"

I decided to go with a "nah, not compiled languages, no..."

On my linkedin profile it is clearly mentioned that I am a Java developer.

Recruiter: Hey, I want to offer you a super cool PHP job position.
Me: But I haven’t mentioned anywhere that I am familiar with PHP.
Recruiter: Yeah, I know, but I thought you may want to switch to PHP for a while.
Me: o_O. Fuck you, miss. I do not switch programming languages like I change my socks. Who the fuck teaches you these approaches?

Am I the only one who, when working with dynamically typed languages, never uses dynamic features? Like, I never change a variable type, and make sure functions will only return one data type?
I just think dynamic types leads to so many bugs

I like being self taught because I can work at my own pace and try different languages to see what interests me most. But so many of these tutorials are just shit. Or the content is good and the instructor is shit. I may need to just suck it up and go to Uni, but I am 19 and enjoy my time working and my free time. I think it's time for me to grow up soon though.

So lately I've been seeing a lot of hate towards languages like C, C++ and java.

Someone at work literally said go would replace C++ and that anyone still using it is a dinosaur.

He said no one uses this languages anymore.

Am I just being left behind or are most real time devs not using C et al anymore.

I mean c++ has a 2017 update and we work with devices for aviation and the like that need to be certified I don't see go becoming our main language anytime soon.

I'm not saying go isn't a good language I'm just saying the others aren't at the point where we take them out back and shoot them.

got given the job of removing a menu link on a site my company hadn't built today.

biggest pile of dung ever! the site had folders for 5 different back end languages all full of random files not in use.

I dug around and found it was using a big framework that produces a massive single variable and outputs it as the page.

Eventually I realised this wasn't in use either but was still being loaded in the site! in fact the site even has a database and an admin login but the stupid original dev hard coded all the content in and runs includes to files in the admin folder directly from config!

such a confusing, pointless, shit site! Its like building a car and driving it like Fred from the Flintstones....

Am I the only one who thinks that with all the scripting languages starting programming becomes to easy and so learning really good programming is getting nearly impossible because every tutorial is made for total n00bs and every forum is full of: hey my hello world programs isn't working?

Ps:I have no problem with people starting programming with languages like c# and python, I think just there are too many people saying that they are programmers just because they wrote hello world.

Pps: sry 4 my English.

OK heavy rant on 'modern' software development coming! --> don't take it to seriously though :-)

Electron... why does that shit exist? It is like stacking all the worst technologies available to mankind into an enormous pile of crap and polishing that turd to look like something wonderful. It is big, slow and overall AWFUL!

An example? ... Microsoft Teams :-( it burns your PC like fire and makes it squeal for mercy.

When a library/framework becomes the ultimate evolution of abstraction layer upon abstraction layer and it simply should stop to exist and a reset button needs to be pressed.

I would love to see some research on the real world environmental impact that all those shitty slow and bloated web technologies have.

Solution:

Software energy label!

C, C++ and Rust e.t.c. and all accompanying efficient UI libraries should be the only languages/implementations allowed to get a A, B and C label.

Python (without C libraries like Numpy), JavaScript and all those other slow interpreted scripting/Web API nonsense should get a D, E or F label by default.

Have fun!

A lot of the string operations in Python, because they are named like shit.

First you have startswith. No underscore. Just two words glued together. No case notation, nothing. So ugly and difficult to remember when Python isn't your only language.

And then there's tolower. Wait, no, it's actually just lower. If we're gonna stick with the shitty naming, can we at least keep the two-words, no underscore thing? No, I guess it's easier to save those two characters.

And isupper, the function to get supper from your iPhone.

Yeah, it's small. But aren't most of our gripes about languages tiny anyways.

I’ve been programming with other languages than Python for so long that when I finally had to pick up Python to help teach my friend some python I felt like I was rediscovering a past life.

With Python I feel like King Fucking Arthur with the Holy Blade Excalibur, armored up and ready for fucking war.
When I’m writing a script I feel like I’m parrying and piercing my blade straight through that fuckers chest and slam them into the fucking ground. And leave their bleeding out cold dying body on the fucking ground with no hope in their eyes.

Although when an indentation error occurs I feel like I just fucking tripped over a fucking pebble and apparently stairs were nearby and I bash my head on all 1024 steps, get to the bottom to just to get some fucking Java Chad punt my fucking head like a fucking football screaming random reasons to not use python.

My manager just had a chat with me, following up on our previous conversation. I think in an attempt to get me to stay.

Him: "From the work you're doing, it looks like you're really trying, putting a lot of thought into your code"
Me: I thought I was half assing it...

Him: "You'll learn by coding in new languages"
Me: "I've professionally coded in 8 different programming languages, including the ones we use here"

Him: "We do meaningful code reviews where we try to understand what the code is doing, not like other places"
Me: So, just like every other company I've worked at?

I've been using microsoft dev stack for as long as i remember. Since I picked up C#/.NET in 2002 I haven't looked back. I got spoiled by things like type safety, generics, LINQ and its functional twist on C#, await/async, and Visual Studio, the best IDE one could ask for.

Over the past few years though, I've seen the rise of many competing open source stacks that get many things right, e.g. command line tooling, package management, CI, CD, containerization, and Linux friendliness. In general many of those frameworks are more Mac friendly than Windows. Microsoft started sobering up to this fact and started open sourcing its frameworks and tools, and generally being more Mac/Linux friendly, but I think that, first, it's a bit too late, and second, it's not mature yet; not even comparable to what you get on VS + Windows.

More recently I switched jobs and I'm mainly using Mac, Python, and some Java. I've also used node in a couple of small projects. My feeling: even though I may be resisting change, I genuinely feel that C# is a better designed language than Java, and I feel that static type languages are far superior to dynamic ones, especially on large projects with large number of developers. I get that dynamic languages gives you a productivity boost, and they make you feel liberated, but most of the time I feel that this productivity is lost when you have to compensate for type safety with more unit tests that would not be necessary in a static type language, also you tend to get subtle bugs that are only manifested at runtime.

So I'm really torn: enjoy world class development platform and language, but sacrifice large ecosystem of open source tools and practices that get the devops culture; or be content with less polished frameworks/languages but much larger community that gets how apps should be built, deployed, monitored, etc.

Damn you Microsoft for coming late to the open source party.

Well, it finally happened.

After 25 years coding in all types of languages and environments, I’m no longer having fun.

It now seems like it’s a fight to get interested in the code. I used to be something that I would spend hours / days doing. Now I just want to walk away from the code.

Is it true (do you think) that after a while all you see is a for loop, an if statement, a null check and you just think to yourself. Fuck this! Because I think I’m there.

God it’s depressing to think that I no longer find it fun.

My first ever post! So awesome to find out dev rant and cheer up my day as I go thru everyone's story/rant.

I was single the whole time while I'm at school. After graduated, I finally pick up the pace to date girls. So I signed up for a few online dating sites/apps. Every single time that I create a new profile for the app/site, I always get frustrated and confused about the language field. Especially when there's only selector or check box for languages selections.

Like, where's JavaScript, PHP, HTML5, Css3, Ruby, on the selector or check box. I think a suggestions to those dating site/app dev needs to rethink the options for language selections. At least try to let us developers have a better profile than normal people! :-/

After years around devs of all levels of expertise I have found the following to be true mostly of junior developers.

Junior devs seem to like to pick out a single (or few) idiosyncrasies of a language/framework and then call it shitty overall.

While senior devs have seen the small idiosyncrasies of many languages/frameworks and know that none of them are perfect and those quirks come with the territory.

It may also have something to do with senior devs having less to prove and therefore not wasting their time of such useless language debates....

ROUND 1: FIGHT!

All the time while I'm programming I hate Java.... Don't hate me now :D I'm learning Java in high school. I very love very fast programming languages such as C and C++, so this is why I don't like Java, but there are some reasons why I like Java. I just started learning how to create own window. What the hack is this? This is so simple. I tried to create window in C/C++ with OpenGL, just blank window with color. Complicated..... But with java it's fairy tale.
You can add me now to Java familly, but remember I also love C++.

So here your are, Hello World Java FX app :D

Final goal:
Create window application similar scratch.

Update on my old rant: I started writing type definitions for our project (it's basically a chunk of separate files where you document the objects you use; typed languages have this out of the box, js doesn't and it may become useful depending on the size of the project). Our codebase is reasonably big -not complicated, but big- and I felt like I was losing track of all the properties\objects\usage\comments\whatever. So I iiterally wrote some ts interfaces: properties with name and types, that's it, so you know what you're passing around.
Proposal was denied, I'll have to delete the documentation; "keeping the doc updated is going to require more work".

Me: Ok, but what am I supposed to do when I need to interface with your code? Run the debugger and figure out what the fuck you guys are passing around?
Team leader: Yes 😊

You know what just gets to me about garbage-collected languages like c# and Java? Fucking dynamic memory allocation (seemingly) on the stack. Like it's so bizzare to me.

"Hey, c#, can I have an array of 256 integers during run-time?"

"Ya sure no prob"

"What happens when the array falls out of scope"

"I gotchu fam lol"

In PHP (yes, it's a language I... don't hate) I've always hated exceptions. They're like GOTO, in an OOP world with interfaces and contracts, try/catch is really odd as it breaks a promise about returning with a typed value.

But you can now do this in PHP8, which comes pretty close to Maybe/Either monads (Option, Result whatever it's called in other languages):

function getUser(): User | UserNotFound

PHP8 unions don't come with the same strong guarantees as in other languages but *pets PHP gently on the head* you did well, my boy.

Now I would really love it if PHP9 could do:

function getUsers(): Collection<User>

Type Tree<T> = Null | Node<T>;
function 🎄(): Tree<Branch<Ornament|Light|null>>

PHP ist one of the languages I use regularly, but not the main language.
Anyhow, passing an array to a function will create a Copy of the array unless you specifically choose to Pass the reference.
That's seriously fucked up. What other language does that?! Coming from C, Java, Python to PHP I was not prepared to expect shit like that.

So here I am in class with just two weeks of knowledge in coding and this douchebag level 300 comes in like, 'Hey i'm a hacker and mid tier programmer and i can see you struggling with your basic code can i be of help?'... so I'm like, 'yh man. I'm a transfer biology student and i don't know a sh*t about coding but i have managed to buid a fine website of just two pages but i would also like to try hacking but first what programming languages do you know?' Guess what......the lil f*cker said HTML. I mean I may not know much but i know that can and will never be a programming language.

I don’t like to judge people based on what languages they like (because I like all of them). But I can’t deny the pattern anymore.

Smart people know and enjoy smart languages: Smalltalk, OCaml, Clojure, Lisp, Haskell, etc. They may use JavaScript or PHP to make money, but ask them to code in their smart language and they’ll be more efficient. Getting old, some of those people say “screw it” and find a Haskell job.

You, my friend, are not one of those people. You are VSCode-dwelling goblin who thinks lambda calculus has something to do with JS arrow function notation, is scared of reduce() and not even good at the single fucking language they know.

Insta coders and that mechanical keyboard collector dorks are not “superstars” you got to be like.

If you like looking at language designers fight on Hacker News (and who doesn't?) go ahead and search for the V programming language or Vlang as it is also called and also for the posts that the creator of Odin lang has done in regards to V langs creator.

Its a shitstorm. Apparently both languages have been designed as alternatives to C (not as in "this will kill C!!" like rust does) and occasionally you will find some posts from the Zig language creator.

Fascinating fights actually, have been able to learn a thing or two about why some ideas concerning language design are whacky etc.

I am also trying to understand language design better, which is the main reason why I appreciate all of them fights.

10/10 best drama series I have seen thus far.

Does anyone feel overwhelmed by all the new technologies? It's like every developer nowadays code in JS, and knows ES6, React, webpack, babel by heart. I have been working in Java for less than a decade and sometimes feel like I can't catch up. Even in Java ecosystem there is now Scala, Groovy, Gradle, Kotlin... Not to mention other languages like Python, Swift... How do you guys have time to pick up everything?? 😖

Languages like python and R are some-what high level languages, with an easy syntax and very readable code. This useful essentially to make it easier for non-programmers to use it. For me as a software developer with +4 years of professional programming. I started with Assembly, Quick-Basic to C++, Java then C#, I found Python super convenient, and at times way too convenient.
At first it felt like I was cheating, and would not consider myself actually writing code, more like pseudo-coding.
After a year or so, I got used to it and it became my default, but it still does not feel right .. is anyone else feeling the same?
I do believe that coding the hard way is not always the right way, but I am just wired that way.

I've always been critical of python as a development language because of it's efficiency issues and the fact that it's essentially pseudocode. However, today I had to reflect 200 coordinated over the line x=355 for a course lab and I hella didn't feel like doing it in my normal languages. Wrote it using python in less than 2 minutes. It might be a bad language for efficiency, but it's one hell of a scripting language. Sorry, python. I never fully appreciated you until now.

seeing these things make me very uncomfortable, I feel like reaching into the software and wiping it off, makes me wonder how much of a mess this npm ecosystem is going to become, I really dont know much of how these things work. I figured the issue could probably be the same across languages, libraries sitting atop libraries until the whole thing becomes unmanageable. I'll stop rambling now

that's the installation of expo-cli

So I've taken over a project, well, not really taken over, we've been hired to add more functionality to a Wordpress site.

I have never seen such a messy code in my life... variables have mixed languages, indentation is a mix of tabs, 2, 3 and 4 spaces, camelcase, snake case, short names, long names. ' and ", no spaces after commas (gotta save those bytes doode)
Almost like it has been copypasted from everywhere.

I think I said 10-15 hours for it. I think I will spend a lot more time tidying up this code.

Hey, look, 3 index files!!
index.php
index__backup.php
index__backup_2.php

I don't dare to look into the CSS or JS, but I know I have to

There was a computer programming teacher in my 1st semester who taught C. He used to have this conventional way of teaching C like other Engineering subjects which was going to more theories before writing actual codes.
These are the conversations with him.
(First day, a guy asks him some questions.)
Guy: Sir, why do we need to learn C? There are other languages used extensively for other tasks like python,etc. Why bother with this boring C?
Teacher: C is used to learn other languages. After learning C, you can easily learn other languages.
Guy: Sir, where is C's application? Where is it used?
Teacher: It is used in academics to lay foundation for students to learn other languages which are used to build softwares.
(Fucking Hilarious)

(A month after he was asking some questions to students.)
Teacher: What is an array? What is an array-name?
Student 1: Array, is this collection of data that can be stored in a single type.
Teacher: Then what is an array-name?
Student 1: I don't know.
Teacher: (angrily) Array-name is a definition itself.
(We were supposed to answer that. It was a standard definition.)

So today I saw another 'OOP should die' article.
And I decided I should google around a bit to find out why.

Reasons I found:
- Things get too complicated
- Things get too abstract (same as the above really)

But when I search for alternatives, only functional programming and different ways to use OOP get mentioned.
I still don't get why OOP is supposedly bad though.
Maybe my 20-30k LOC projects aren't big enough to see it?

For me the abstraction works very well. The abstraction is used to keep the complexity low(er).
And the different ways of using OOP are a plus-point for me. (Like the Entity-Component system)

I don't know enough about functional programming to be able to say it's better or worse, but the ideas behind it a perfectly usable in languages like C#.

So if any of you have a good concrete reason to not use OOP, please feel welcome to tell me in the comments :)

If you think learning a language / working with a language you don't like is offensive to you and your morals .. Then don't do it.

Money is important to you ? Then you're just prostituting yourself to some higher authority. So DONT COMPLAIN!

You have the right to hate stuff while being paid for it. Understandable.

But don't shit on the shit you think is shit just cause you put yourself in the situation of not having an option !!

You're a worthless. Money hungry whore.

Yes, you hate Java/ x language but have to work on it ?

You're either a whore or have serious problems with standing up for yourself, but on the internet you become this amazing troll saying the language has problems.

Half the people who hate languages hate them cause it's common to hate them. Like being racist in the early American ages cause it was "normal".

Brain deficient motherfucking whores. Manipulated cocksuckers.

Sidenote : if you've honestly gotten shit on by a new version of the language you were using .It's understandable and I'm on your side. Using it without thorough research on the other hand is your mistake. Languages aren't ideal. Just Like most women don't like your dick cause, well it doesn't fit their use case. Deal with it not, troll about it.

I'm not like you. I experiment with whatever I like before using it. I work on my own stuff. I suck my own fucking dick and I get paid.

If you honestly disagree with me, put a couple points down on the language you hate and why you hate it ( considering the fact that you have actually used it and are not just trying to disagree with me )

As a freelancing student my customer (CEO) asked to build a project management system.
I was like: we can smoothly get to know each other by setting up a simple .xlsm
ENGAGE™.gif

On 2/3 of project, shareholder comes in: make it like office. I want the same as ms office but built by you.

Me: sure. Why not. I'll a have a little chat with friends being experts on this.
FuckThisRage.webm

Who does he think he is. What does he believe one single human is capable of. What a jerkTard

Forced a high expense allowance and gave them some gibberish copy pasta, sealed .xlsm containing 3 languages all but macro

#peaceout

When it comes to the indentation or look I am fully consistent.
But when it comes to naming I am inconsistent like a crack whore telling she's clean.
Camelcase, underscores inconsistent variable and function names. I use all of them within a single file. On some days I even switch languages.
I truly am miserable in code consistency. Is there any good advice to keep the code consistent?

Dynamically typed languages suck. God I hate them

It's like one big clunky free for all. I don't understand how people can work in Python or even JavaScript and tell me that they're good languages with a straight face

Not having proper autocomplete or documentation (a somewhat seperate issue of Python) is a kick in the stomach for productivity.
I've seen people advocate for using EXTERNAL DOCUMENTATION VIEWERS. WHAT

I hate not being able to enforce types so I can reason about little parts of my program. I hate not having an IDE that can actually help me. I hate having to see stupid grep'ed code snippets instead of nicely formatted javadocs. I hate having to double and triple check everything when trying to code. I hate handling effectively opaque values where I don't know anything about the type without looking it up. And I especially hate not knowing what types function parameters need to be.

Dynamic typing doesn't remove types. That, although completely unfeasible, I could respect.
Oh no, the types are still there. Just not for you

It's like solving a jigsaw puzzle with a blindfold on

Guy sees me on my laptop and says "is that Linux?". I say yes then he says he is into computer "stuff and can hack anything". Not having a clue what that means I replied with a "awesome".

I don't have really any friends that are into "computers", so I decided to play ball.

I asked, "Are you into coding?.. he says, "Yes". Then I ask, " What languages?" He says, " Just what ever, anything really, it depends on what I am doing."

At this point I understand what is going on but it is so awkward. He continues.. "Recently I used.. what's it called abd or adb, you know I like rooted my phone"...

And let's talk about something else....

Why do people feel the need to lie or whatever you might call what happened. It might be different I think if he wasn't about 40.

I feel like this is a pretty common story

I started thinking and worrying about numbers much more than before

in the US, you write numbers like this:
1,000.00
in Germany usually like this:
1.000,00
and in programming languages like this:
1000.00

now i wonder how to type a number, whenever i have to use german software
should i use the US way, the german way or the dev way? the wrong one could possibly break it

Hey DevRant Fam! Hope everyone is doing very well! Just would like to ask, for awhile now i have been focusing on languages such as c++, C#, Java, and little bit of python the others I mentioned before were mainly from Uni, but I’d like to step out of my comfort zone a little, I’m interested in learning things such as “NodeJS”.

I actually haven’t laid much of a finger on JS so i do not know much, and i also see things such as Nodejs, react are very popular and would like to step my foot in the door, what would you guys suggest and or recommend :-) I’m open to listen to you guys and learn more!.

Hope everyone is doing well wherever you may be!

Thank you 😊
Milo

3 hours...

3 damn hours for 200 lines of bash code.

Exorcism, Magic I don't care.... But please make a special person never touching bash programming again.

I ripped my hairs out. Really.

Till I realized someone wrote functions with _logical_ return true codes as numbers.

0 - as logical false, for failure
1 - as logical true, for success

Leading my brain into a severe segfault fun.

Why... Oh why.

Second fun part as I corrected that...

Someone wasn't fond of exit codes at all.

Script is now 86 % rewritten....

God damn it, if you don't like a languages fine.

But inverting core logic should give a free trip to the electrical chair.

!rant per se

It’s funny, until junior year of uni I was a strong advocate of Java and was willing to argue the case for it. One thing that I definitely was taught in uni that a language is just a tool (for the most part). It’s the theory that matters, and that can be applied pretty well to most languages. Have come to the point that I actually get frustrated when people get into arguments of language X being shit or inferior to language Y.
Like many people perceive college as a place to just learn programming and stuff like discrete structures and theory as being time wasting, but i have come to realise that it’s quite the opposite, if you know the concept of something, applying it to a language is easier than learning how to do something in a certain language and then bitch and moan that “it can’t be done” in another language you are forced to work with.

> Advice to new coders

Don't worry over picking language A or B.
Just pick A, use it for a month, then move on to B.
In a normal 3 year college degree you'll try multiple languages, some of which you'll never use again, and they'll each teach you something.

I had classes in Java, C, C++, C#, Prolog, Assembler, F#, JS.

Never used F# again and no one uses Prolog. But they were great for learning recursion and logic.

It's not like you take "a step down a bad path" if you pick a language you're never gonna use again.

You'll also learn new stuff on the job. We have one team that uses Go and one that uses Rust. None of the devs ever studied those languages. They were mostly former Java devs who leaned on the job.

it kinda pisses me off that server side languages don't get the same credit as they used to since single page applications started and everyone asks what front end i use.
i be like dude i use php. then he says oh so you use jQuery for front end.
*facepalm*

Alright. It's one of these rants that everyone despises. The help me rant. Now before you tell me to google, I have, but I want a more personal opinion on the matter.

I am fluent in JAVA, C#, C++, and a few more, but I have never done web development.

I want to get the fuck out of my current job (I got screamed at because I didn't do the PABX guy's work - I am a fucking programmer not a technician), and start a venture there.

Now I know that I have to learn HTML, CSS, JS -> what more do I need to know to code a fully functional website? I don't mind learning any languages, I like learning. It sounds naive and perhaps stupid, but I am asking for some educated opinions.

Thanks, and soon I will be the fuck out of this hellhole.

Not really a rant and I'm only a beginner/hobbyist, but for a few months I've been active in a local gamedev club where I recently managed the courage to approach a much more experienced (5+ years) programmer.

We managed to have a good 30 minute chat (despite not using the same programming languages) and he told me "I really appreciate talking to someone who actually understands programming and what they're talking about!"

It felt like a pretty big milestone on my path to game development, at least it feels like I know more than I care to admit to myself.

You look like someone who unironically puts “JSON” on their resume as one of programming languages they know.

You probably have casual pictures of Dan Abramov saved on your phone.

Now go finish your top 10 coding productivity lifehacks insta tiktok, or go adjust your standing desk one more time, or go type on your custom mechanical keyboard (which probably has different switches for functional keys. Should I call the keys “functional” if a person like this is the only person who presses them though?)

Yeah, you’re a rockstar. Yeah, that next medium article you’ll write is gonna make you famous. Yeah.

These are the things that finally finally helped me stick to learning programming.

Hello world! This is my first story on devrant and I would like to share how I finally overcame the barriers that had always prevent me from learning programming in a more serious and structured way.

I know my way around linux, had some experience with BASIC many years ago and have more than basic notions of cryptography... however I never got myself to learn programming in such a way that I could write an app or interact with an API. Until now.

I have advanced more than ever before and I believe it might be thanks to these aspects:

1. C#
I have always had struggles with languages that were too compact or used many exotic or cryptic expressions. However I have found C# to be much more readable and easier to understand.

2. Visual Studio
My previous attempts at learning programming were without an IDE. Little did I know what I was missing!

For example when I tried learning python on Debian, I almost went crazy executing programs and trying to find the compile errors in a standard text editor.

Intellisense has been live changing as it allows me to detect errors almost immediately and also to experiment. I'm not afraid to try things out as I know the IDE will point out any errors.

3. .NET library and huge amounts of documentation
It was really really nice to find out how many well documented classes I had available to make my learning process much easier, not having to worry about the little details and instead being able to focus on my program's logic.

4. Strong typing
Call me weird, but I believe that restricting implicit conversions has helped learn more about objects, their types and how they relate to each other.

I guess I should be called a C# fanboy at this point, but I owe it to that language to be where I'm now, writing my first apps.

I also know very very little about other languages and would love to hear if you know about languages that provide a similar experience.

Also, what has helped you when you first started out?

Thanks!!

What kind of music do you guys listen too when you're coding? I need recommendations!

I can't do anything with English lyrics (other languages are fine. As long as I don't understand the lyrics, it's not distracting), so I usually stick to instrumental like animals as leaders, polyphia, Chon, etc or German metal: Rammstein, oomph, wbtbwb, etc

Whatcha guys got?

Recently got out of the military now I work a full time job, have a wife and a 15 month old son, go to college full time online and try to learn Java and android development in my other time. I want to work as a developer so badly but I'm just not good enough yet. It's also super hard to know what level of knowledge you need to obtain a job because all entry level positions want you to have years of experience in 10 fucking languages and shit like what the fuck? No breaks, hungry to succeed.

== Internship Interview Rant ==

This is the weirdest interview I've been to to be honest because it wasn't really ABOUT ME. It's like the boss is not really interesting in knowing what I can do, what I am capable of doing. He asked me about my educational background for 5 minutes and started explaining about the startup for 45 minutes. He explained how he came up with the idea like it was a children's bedtime story. He explain what the job is, BUT he didn't mention what programming languages they use. All he said was it required knowledge about different programming languages. I tried asking but he seemed to dodge the question for some reason by saying everyone needs to know a little bit of everything. (Srsly i don't even know what to start learning for this) After listening to him talk and talk and talk and talk, he finally said "hey, think about it and send me an email if you are willing to take it up!"

He works with STUDENTS. The team is composed of him and 5 students. o.O They all seem so..... quiet in the office. Is that normal ???? Or like shouldn't everyone be kinda "interactive" sometimes?

So there is a girl working there too for 3 weeks now but SHE IS IN ROMANIA like wtf, gr8 then i guess ill be the only girl there but hey perks of being a girl, u get to be spoiled sometimes XD it happens a lot !

Internship ad ----> Main language: English
Me: *rages internally during the interview and thinks: BRUHH WHY ARENT U SPEAKING IN ENGLISH i prepared what I was gonna say in english for an hour*
I wonder if the code is in english or maybe its not :(( But I wish it were because it would be soooo much easier in english.

And there you go, I guess I have one week to find a better internship or decide to deal with this talkative boss. This isn't exactly a story of my last job cause my last job is totally non-dev related. This is a story of (maybe) my future job unless I actually find a better internship.

The ones who use it, what do you like or value about Linux? Why do you use it?

Before I answer, let me say that I am a noob compared to the rest of this community. I run Ubuntu because Arch was too complicated when I tried and bash scripts equal to frustrations for me. That's my knowledge level.

- I don't feel "observed" when using a Linux distro compared to Windows and macOS.
- Feel more connected to the open source thought and the free spirit.
- Feel like I can do anything I want. Learning new programming languages easily, trying out web servers, try and setup own website or mail server etc.
- Everything is accessible. Read something cool about docker? ALT+T to open a terminal and start up a docker container to try out.
- No Internet browsing for software, like googling "Firefox download english".
- Sometimes forces me to learn about the workings of a computer, like networks, servers, routing, firewalls, bootup sequence etc.
- So many great command line tools. Want to find out quickly who owns a website? Want to query a specific DNS server? All possible within 5 seconds!

All in all using Linux feels like watching a documentary while using Windows is more like watching a dumb comedy show where I can turn my brain off, but get more stupid after a while.

!rant
So, Rust again.
When I learned that Rust doesn’t support inheritance, only traits (interfaces), I was shocked at first.

Then I tried to remember when the last time was that I have used inheritance in the code that I write (not the code that I use).

And I could remember an instance some months ago. But I also remember that I was very unsatisfied with that design and refactored it to use composition instead. And it was much better.

One of Rust’s properties is that many good practices in other programming languages are enforced rules in Rust.
And in case of inheritance, it seems like Rust decided that composition over inheritance is such a good practice that it should be a rule.

I’m not 100% convinced that there never will be cases where inheritance is better. But I still like this radical idea of forcing the devs to do it "the right way" in the majority of (if not all) cases.

I think many devs will disagree.
What do you think?

I prefer functional style programming because it is easier to me to think in modules and functional hierarchies than it is object style shierarchies.

All in all, languages like F# and Clojure have always been fascinating to me. I wish I could find a use case for Haskell, but I can't. If anything F# is awesome to me because I already know .NET and really dig the entire framework, the strides made by Core are outstanding.

I had tried Scala before and just couldn't get into it. Far easier to just stick to Java even if I hate the idea of extending classes all over the place.

Ocaml is interesting too, but I know little to nothing about it, and Elixir looks far too much like Ruby for my taste even if I do like Ruby.

Choice is good, but sometimes overwhelming

So... I cannot find me an internship which uses low level languages ( like c, c++ ) or something like elixir, rust, haskell... the only internships available are in mobile and web development...

Don’t know what to do anymore... it’s annoying, and so so frustrating... and I NEED an internship if I wanna get a college degree...

Code languages should stay within their designated file extensions! I'm having to work with SQL in .resx files at the moment! Then there's HTML which is like a skitty little travelling monkey that I've found blundering about in SQL strings before, let alone people trying to sneak it into .js files, which is one reason I chose Angular over React btw (and don't give me that bullshit of separations of concerns vs separation of technologies).

It is mostly trivial to work with separate files across languages and doing so gives you the benefits of that languages support in the text editor or IDE you are using. It becomes easier to work with, the behaviour is predictable and it is formatted in a readable manner, ultimately reducing the potential for mistakes. Stop trying to make me put everything in strings!!

This happen to me once when I was a young kid walking home from school.

There were two other guys with me, older than me. They were talking to each other about programming languages. I have been programming from a very young age so I knew a lot about programming and I knew a few languages back then, but they were taking about Java, a language which I wasn't into yet back then, so I just listened for a while to what they had to say.

The first guy told the other, "You know I'm great at Java." The other guy responded "I can do anything in Java." Then I said as a joke "Oh, can you do hello world?". The guy said "Hello what? What do you mean?" The other guy said. "Is that a retro game?" I just laughed. Then I told them to go learn how to output text in Java.

A bit of current history about these guys:
The first now works in C# for a quiz test company, he never learned Java or languages other than C#. The second one owns and works at a scrapyard. They are both great guys, but they like to brag.

You know what I god dam hate.

The likes of Microsoft, twitter and Github trying to change the English language and the definition of words based on your bad history.

How about, instead of banning words like Master branch and server slaves. You instead hand the language back to the English people and fix the spelling mistakes in all modern day programming languages!!!!

Talk about cultural appropriation!!

I've taken a year's break from university to work on projects using various languages. For the first half, I've been trying to produce as much as possible. Now, I'm taking my time and producing less. I've gotta say, I'm enjoying it far more now. I feel like I'm learning more and producing better quality code.

Literally anything that comes out from Anders Hejlsberg, always liked what the dude brings to others. I fucking loved his work on the Pascal Programming language, back then it was all over the place in Mexico. I can only imagine that in the U.S it was just as big since a lot of mfkers in here are still pushing Delphi from what they found with Turbo Pascal.

His work on the C# programming language is absolutely incredible and C# is one of the best languages in my book. And I fucking adore TypeScript, so literally, everything this dude puts out, I pay attention, listen to and learn. As far a language designers go, him and Rich Hickey are my top favorite mfkers in the field, but Anders it to me a personal idol.

I also happen to really fucking like C# and Clojure man, like come on those two are just legit good languages.

Holy shit Sololearn is actually such a Well Designed app to just learn the Basics of languages. Really smooth Animations and Fun Quizzes
(Btw, This Text was written with Google Keyboard which some how is so bad, i need to Switch Back to SwiftKey like STOP CAPITALIZING RANDOM WORDS GOOGLE!!)

!Rant

Do you guys have a idea how I can call my new snippet manager application? The application allows you to save code and URLs to view Inside of the application. Also the application is highly customizable supporting 42 coding Languages and over 42 Themes. Currently its named: "SNIPR". But i would like a Name thats not directly connected to the application and what it does. Maybe you guys have some ideas? Because im not that creative😀😀👌

This is a example of the main ui using the dark theme

You know what really grinds my gears? When people criticize a programming language but uses edge cases and stuff that can be avoided by using the tried and true "don't be an idiot". Take for instance JavaScript, a language I like and a language that has a lot you can criticize. But I feel like a lot of peoples criticism isn't warranted.

What's that? No ints? Use parseInt or Math.floor.

What are you saying? == works in strange ways? Yes, that's what we have === for.

Type coercion is wonky? Think it's weird how string + int works differently than string - int? Wanna string with number + - + - - + - - etc? Don't! Don't add strings and ints, don't subtract strings and ints. You can't in statically typed languages and you aren't supposed to in dynamically typed

Adding arrays and objects, arrays and arrays, objects and objects etc. is inconsistent? Why are you trying to do that?

Adding floats together gives odd results? Now we're getting somewhere! And Mozilla responded to that with a method called toFixed.

Declaring variables with var doesn't always work that well? Use let and const

Then there's this weird attitude that some people I've met have, where they will complain about the module system and how "well you rely on the community for those packages" as if it's a bad thing. And then coming with the "well you don't know what the (open source) packages do internally" as if I (for the most part) give a shit. Then they'll swear by companies like Zend or Microsoft as if they can't just stop supporting the languages they use. Maybe it's just because I like community content more because of video game mods.

Wanna criticize JS, then there's plenty to talk about. Like the built in date object is basically shit. Or how in NodeJS you can have node_modules in your node_modules. Or how classes don't really have the best syntax. Left-Pad. And so on (it's too late for me to be able to remember much more).

!rant
Looking for advice, serious advices.

I work in C.
Also, I work in Python.
I have worked for a couple of year in C++.
I have a fair knowledge of the Data Science workflow, and some experience in Machine Learning.
I have tinkered with some other languages (Java, Ruby, Go, JS among the others, nothing serious nor professional)

I'm the kind of person who needs constant problems to face in order to keep engaged, satisfied, happy. And I need to learn new stuff, or refining my knowledge constantly, or I stagnate. I believe that this is true for quite a share of people here.

I would like to spend some spare time (I seldom have) in a project. Personal projects are rarely good enough to improve one's cv, so I thought I could partecipate in some Open Source projects.

Does anyone here have some suggestion about some interesting and satisfying OSProject, or some general suggestion on the matter?

It would be so apreciated.

Left a php job because I was fed up with php and was promised I could work with different languages.

Start new job, 2 weeks of work with a different language. A few days away from completing the micro service and it's been decided it's going to be deleted and I've been told I'm now to fix bugs in php.

Actually given up on life. Dont want to go in. Want to work at KFC. Had enough of being a php fixer :'(

Feel like the job I was sold now doesn't exist.

I honestly don't get the idea behind JavaScript frameworks. Like, if JavaScript on its own is really so bad that it's only usable for front-end devs with a framework.. why has nobody considered committing back their changes into JavaScript itself? Makes life easier for everyone.

Also, regarding the framework.. as far as I understand it's a bunch of functions that you load in, right? But do you really need all of those, to the point where the unused ones are justifiable? And wouldn't it make more sense to write them yourself as you need them? I mean that's at least the idea of functions in languages like Bash or C or whatever.

What's the point of frameworks?

Another draw I found while cleaning my room. I made this on my last semester of the career at university.

Yeah, another Php. Remember the “Php elephant thong guy”? (Reference to another rant I posted) Here I’m fighting him with several programming languages. I remember that I made this because he only coded on php and jQuery, and I said to him “you’ll need to learn another languages if you want to apply to a new job”.

Which programming languages can you identify?

P.D. I don’t like PHP that much, I’d rather use Python or C#

I quite dislike the fact that Python is growing in popularity. It's a fun toy, but the syntax is so fucking annoying after a while. Forced indentation is certainly not my style. Furthermore, Python is generally not extremely performant, even as far as interpreted languages go.

I love python as a language but using it to work (Like... for money...?) seems very outlandish. It feels akin to scratch to me... very bizzare to think it is powering many complex AIs. Python is a toy.

PHP...
When I first learned to code - like everyone - I felt the need to try as many programming languages as possible. After the comforting syntax of myClass.MyProperty/myClass.MyFunction()/C#, the $ symbols everywhere made me want to vomit...
Fast forward 2 years later. I learned a bit and wanted to make a website backend. Checked my hosting - which was purely a frontend thing at the time - free PHP hosting or £15/month for ASP .NET hosting...
I begrudingly wrote my first .php file, hating my life.
But by the end of that night my relationship with PHP was already cemented.
And that's why I like PHP.

Student here.

For those who got a degree in CS or similar, what is some advice you can offer to a sophomore in school?

The education I have gotten so far for a Software Engineering degree seems like it isn't enough. So far, I only know C++ and front end web development. Besides the little tiny projects they give us, they do not teach us how the field works.

One of my most lingering questions of all is.. what technologies should I know before interning and/or job hunting?!?! There are dozens of languages for everything; I'm lost. I feel the pain for developers in the future who have to catch up on technologies.

I have heard that learning C++ will make it easier to learn other languages. I won't know until I start another language (too busy working in the summers).

What regrets do you have? What do you wish you could've known while studying as a student or self-teaching yourself?

From now on I decree that we should all call programming languages her. We should use the pronoun her like you would use for a boat.

"Aye she's a fine lass indeed sir, able to handle scale with grace and charm.."

Also, to speak with a Scottish accent.

I have hereby decreed it, it shall be so.

HTML & CSS.

To me they just feel wrong.

I have been working with them for a little over 20 years now, and it feels like very little has improved. Sure we learned to make things look a bit nicer, we got new tags and properties, but the syntax is still horrible.

The fact that both are replaced by other imperfect languages (haml, jade, less, sass, etc) is just a confirmation that their paradigms are about as fucked up and impossible to exterminate as cobol.

Which points at another problem: browsers, and how slow the web upgrade cycle is — adding native support for nested style definitions in css, or replacing html with a json document seems like a trivial problem, if it weren't for the dozens of browsers and the excruciating pace at which they can adopt standards.

I'm taking a computer sciece course for Java and I'm just getting into it. I have done other similar things but in different languages and one day the class was discussing the meaning of static and all of a sudden he stops projecting his screen and says one moment and I look at what he's doing and he's googling what to do like WTH your supposed to be teaching us not feeding us answers from google

!rant

So coming from the interpreted language world (mainly using python), I'm always amazed on how compiled languages work. Especially C.

Every time I use C, it's like everything is sooooo faster (runtime), and yes I've read about it so many times. It's just that I can't explain this great feeling about actually seeing the results of using C.

Man, I think I just love C (even though I'm still confused in using pointers).

Last year I had to program most of my projects in Python. I like the language, don't get me wrong. But man oh man if you indent your line of code one too many fucking times, it can be such a pain in the ass to find your error...

Even if it may clutter your code (not in my opinion), that's why I love them curly brackets and languages which use them <3

Sometimes I feel like I am surrounded by idiots. My family are too stupid and lazy to have jobs or do anything involving a skill. They are too dumb to do anything properly so most of the house is fucked.

My co-workers are supposed to be Web devs but cba to learn the frameworks or languages we work on. Some of them have over 5 years experience and don't understand basics like backend verification vs front end.. Or even what json is. Needless to say everything I'm told to do is retarded such as implement roles and permissions where there are no roles, but ot allowed to add roles.

Anyone else surrounded by idiots 90% of the time? How do you not get worn down?

I wish I had programming friends in my life all I have are kids at middle school that dont know anything about programming and left alone to my mind about all the languages I know and I am left with home work that's like 9th grade math even though I'm in 8th annnd including science,English,And history PE don't mind but out of them all I wish I had programming friends yay 😒 looking forward towards 8th grade again 😒

Am I the only one who enjoys learning low languages like C/C++ and absolutely hate Java (seriously FUCK Java so much I hate using it)

Working with pointers and just having the compiler completely explode in your face because you forgot a semicolon or an index out of bounds maybe a bracket just disappeared and you are frustrated but then you fix it and voila it works like magic.

Maybe it's just a thing of mine because C++ was the first programming language I learned and I miss this feeling of hopelessness (I think I might have done BDSM fetishes) and it makes me feel nostalgic.

When I was first learning them all I thought about was how cool this stuff is.

I dunno why but I decided to look up programming languages in the urban dictionary. Currently, I am fucking around with Rust since I believe it is the best offering by far in terms of writing webassembly programs, or at least the one I like the most (blazor makes me pp soft, but I am still hoping it gets better)

This is what I found inside of the entry for rust:

"Rust is an ancient African word, meaning "I can't learn C++"

Also known for a borrow-checker which makes soydevs crazy."

I thought it was fucking hilarious.

to the guys saying "oop is dumb" / "i don't need oop" / "i've never worked with oop"...

i have some questions:
- which language are you working with
- which problems are you solving
- how big is your code base
- how do you maintain readability of your code?

don't get me wrong, i don't believe that oop is always the answer. i'm just curious which fields these statements are coming from. if they all come from a low level (assembler, C, ..) or functional languages or "scripty" languages (python, JS), or if there are also people working with languages like C++ where oop is pretty much established. and if the latter, i'm curious how people design their code and what problems they solve... tell me your story :D

Hey everybody been a while but I have a rant. Swift fucking swift and IOS dev. Okay so been learning swift for some frontend casual work, no worries they are lending me a mac to work in.

Now comes the rant part IOS is fine to work in I dont have any qualms about platform but.. FOR THE LOVE OF COMMON FUCKING SENSE GET SOME FUCKING CONSISTENCY.

You have made swift statically typed language to supposedly make developing more consistant and better fine no worries i dont like static typed languages cause they are unnecessary but fine. then you go NAH FUCK IT EVERYTHING IN A MODULE IS IN GLOBAL SCOPE, FUCK IMPORT STATEMENTS, FUCK MAINTAINABILITY AND FUCK YOU FOR ASKING.

I was a foreign language student, but i didn't like the way my work-life was going (I had a lot of difficulties tryng to find a job).

So I decided to start programming... It appears i'm still studying "languages".

Is my life a joke?

I used to be a Java fanboy.

After seeing the modern things one can do with other languages I am just disappointed, that Java is so old-fashioned.
Some would say "BUT IT HAS LAMBDAS".
Good, that we have lambdas. We don't have optional parameters or objects (like in JS's {} or PHP's stdClass).
JVM may have many advantages, but I think, that Java is slowly dying although it is kept alive by some companies, still using Java in prod.
I think, that Kotlin is, what Java should have been.

I hope, that my wishes will be implemented in Java 10. If not, Java is considered as dead.

The people that religiously put "missing docstring" on code reviews... Like, I get why but... Who hurt you? Especially in typed languages, where there's a function called "can compute stuff" with a foo type, and I add a docstring that's "whether we can compute stuff for the given foo"...

Why is it that virtually all new languages in the last 25 years or so have a C-like syntax?

- Java wanted to sort-of knock off C++.
- C# wanted to be Java but on Microsoft's proprietary stack instead of SUN's (now Oracle's).
- Several other languages such as Vala, Scala, Swift, etc. do only careful evolution, seemingly so as to not alienate the devs used to previous C-like languages.
- Not to speak of everyone's favourite enemy, JavaScript…
- Then there is ReasonML which is basically an alternate, more C-like, syntax for OCaml, and is then compiled to JavaScript.

Now we're slowly arriving at the meat of this rant: back when I started university, the first semester programming lecture used Scheme, and provided a fine introduction to (functional) programming. Scheme, like other variants of Lisp, is a fine language, very flexible, code is data, data is code, but you get somewhat lost in a sea of parentheses, probably worse than the C-like languages' salad of curly braces. But it was a refreshing change from the likes of C, C++, and Java in terms of approach.

But the real enlightenment came when I read through Okasaki's paper on purely functional data structures. The author uses Standard ML in the paper, and after the initial shock (because it's different than most everything else I had seen), and getting used to the notation, I loved the crisp clarity it brings with almost no ceremony at all!

After looking around a bit, I found that nobody seems to use SML anymore, but there are viable alternatives, depending on your taste:

- Pragmatic programmers can use OCaml, which has immutability by default, and tries to guide the programmer to a functional programming mindset, but can accommodate imperative constructs easily when necessary.
- F# was born as OCaml on .NET but has now evolved into its own great thing with many upsides and very few downsides; I recommend every C# developer should give it a try.
- Somewhat more extreme is Haskell, with its ideology of pure functions and lazy evaluation that makes introducing side effects, I/O, and other imperative constructs rather a pain in the arse, and not quite my piece of cake, but learning it can still help you be a better programmer in whatever language you use on a day-to-day basis.

Anyway, the point is that after working with several of these languages developed out of the original Meta Language, it baffles me how anyone can be happy being a curly-braces-language developer without craving something more succinct and to-the-point. Especially when it comes to JavaScript: all the above mentioned ML-like languages can be compiled to JavaScript, so developing directly in JavaScript should hardly be a necessity.

Obviously these curly-braces languages will still be needed for a long time coming, legacy systems and all—just look at COBOL—, but my point stands.

Hey everyone!

I'm on the hunt for new and exciting languages!

I'll state the ones I already know:
Python, Haskell, C(++), C#, Java, JavaScript, Ruby, Rust, Lua, about every kind of Basic, some branches of Lisp, BrainF**k, assembly, Octo (Chip-8) and GML(basically JavaScript).

I've also learnt some styling languages:
Html, CSS, Markup and Markdown.

Some misc languages too: Regex and a runny bit of the Wolfram Language.

Also I'm kind of limited to Windows, Linux and Android, as I do not own any Apple hardware except I have access to an old iPad, so are languages like Swift still good?

Thanks!

I'm a C++ dev, but last month I was working in the vegetable fields to help my young brother and his business. And right now I'm going to sleep outdoor after my birthday party looking at the stars.
Free spirit is a good point dealing with free languages like C++ you know :D
Sweet dreams btw :p

At the age of 10 I got interest in ''changing computer'' things. I started to watch over the shoulder (I don't know if you can say that in English ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ) of my dad. He programmed I2C and other microcontroller.
I started with little batch files and Visual Basic. I think we all know the ''Virus'' with shutdown 😂
At school in the computer lesson we learned a few other languages. I was the only one who learned these languages at home too. The biggest problem is that you think ''I learn at school and at home I can play games''.
Some day I started to learn PHP and Java at home. I came to Java with Minecraft. Yes, Minecraft. You can learn so many things (like the structure of a network packages from the server) and you can visualize everything with blocks.
Since the professional colleague we learn C# and Python which I use in some projects at home too, for example for the rasperrypi.
Now I'm 17 and I can C#, Visual Basic, PHP, JS, Python, JS and HTML

Worst of an job in IT? Coming home and having to fix computer still.

I fucking hate it. I fucking hate computers. There might be great stuff like nifty algorithms, grand theoretical theorems about formal languages, Lisps,... BUT that's so far away from the mundane atrocities we have to put up with when it comes to sth like installing a printer.

Newest release of driver won't install a plugin without helpful error. Older release works.. for printing some pages... Then some component (cups-filter) keeps on segfaulting.

Heya,
College is no place to chill and be laid back as shown in movies. The reality is that it is more challenging than school with peer pressure being no stranger to us.
Being a newbie in the tech domain, and being a girl, I felt the gender gap and the intimidation newbies like me go through when we see legit programmers who flaunt their skills and make it obvious that they exactly know what they are doing.
But along with all this ranting, for all the newbies out there, remember that this phase too shall pass and its not as scary as it seems (I kept convincing myself).
Always start with something easy and take baby steps, one good coding language to start with would be python, as it is more understandable and less intimidating and complex-looking than languages like C and C++.
I still struggle, but there are times when it gave me great joy like the time I developed an app with Flutter or when I managed to grab a free tee from hacktoberfest 2019.
Stay home and Stay safe buddy ;)
P.S: If you a dev and want some cool swags check the website devswag, you won't be disappointed :)

!rant
I’ve just looked into Rust a bit deeper and was absolutely stunned by how many things it has in common with Swift. The Syntax, the features, the concepts, the "philosophy".

Previously I thought that Kotlin is what comes closest to Swift.

Anyway, Rust seems like a beautiful language and it’s no wonder that it is one of the most loved languages out there!

The compile time index out of bounds errors blew my mind!

Today's rant: JavaScript's type system.

I realized halfway through that I can't happily call JavaScript a "programming language" so just assume
alias programming="scripting"

I'm sure it's not actually as frustrating as it seems to me. Thing is, I'm used to either statically-typed languages or dynamically-typed languages that actually make sense. If I were to try to add an integer to something I'd forgotten was a string in Python, it'd immediately tell me "look, buddy, do you want me to treat this as a concatenation or an addition? I have no idea the way you've got this written." I've found that mistakes are a common thing with dynamic typing. Maybe I'm just not experienced enough yet, maybe it's really as stupid as it looks. JavaScript just goes "hey look I'm gonna tack all of these guys together and make a weird franken-string like '$NaN34.$&' because that's absolutely what we want here!" Then I run my webpage and instead of a nice numeric total like I wanted, good old JavaScript just went "Yep, I have no idea what I'm doing here I'm just gonna drop this here and pretend it's right." Now absolutely I do not expect my programming language to make correct assumptions and read my mind, otherwise JavaScript would be programming me and not the other way around. But it could at least let me know that I had incompatible types going on rather than just shamelessly going along with what it's doing. Good GRIEF, man, some of the idiosyncrasies of the EMCAScript language definition itself just make me want to punch a horse.

I am graduating in a few days for my MBO 4(pretty sure that's like community college/college in other countries) in The Netherlands and i'll be going to start working on getting my bachelor.

To prepare, i have devised a learning plan for in the summer.

Should I learn:

(C)++ and Python
(C)++ and NodeJS
(C)++ and C#
or
(C)++ and assembly

C and C++ are languages I want to learn in any case, but as for the others I am undecided.

Thanks

Biggest one is dealing with idiots who break everything. Can’t space anything properly. Oh you needed that function? I got rid of it because it broke my code, and it was easier. Oh yes, just perfect, get rid of a core fucking function you retard that multiple parts of the code rely on. (Luckily it wasn’t pushed to the main, otherwise everything would’ve broken...)

Another one is finishing a damn project, I have like 20 by now... all in different languages that I want to learn. Time comes to work on it? Oh wait, let’s make this because it’s more fun! Just adding more projects to my graveyard.

I read books on programming. The thing I most like about programming books is that they allow you to learn about topics that you would have never have thought to explore. When people look things up online, they tend to search very specific things, most times actual code. The internet is an incredible source for developers, don't get me wrong. But books allow you to learn about programming in a conceptual way which in turn will make learning new languages easier and allow your understanding of the languages you already know to be deeper.

Great googly moogly is Kotlin an ugly language.

If you are just starting out with Android or Java development in general, I highly recommend sticking with Java and avoid Kotlin like the plague. It feels like a meme language that was taken a little too seriously.

Full of little flowery nonsense that aims to make the language more human, but only serves to make it look like a child designed it.

I absolutely hate when a language doesn't require type declarations.

The "it" keyword rankles my underwear beyond belief.

Trying to build a dictionary/hashmap/hash felt like I was writing out an essay for school. In other languages it's straightforward and makes sense. Even PHP makes more sense.

I am obviously missing something here, because there is no way something so common and done the same way across different languages has such a wildly different approach in Kotlin.

I have as much experience with Java as I do Kotlin but it immediately makes more sense as a language and doesn't have all this flowery nonsense. It is verbose, which means I don't have to decipher what the code is actually doing when I read it.

I'm familiar with the enterprise Java meme, but I'm not writing enterprise Java, and that's not my style anyway so it doesn't affect me. But even so, that would be a million times easier to handle that Kotlin.

The company I work for uses Coldfusion which is a dead technology in my opinion. I was tasked with using a data grid for our data from our mssql databases. This data grid I was trying out uses ajax to make a call to the server and expects the data transfered back in Json format. well coldfusion sucks balls because it's serializeJson function returns a outdated JSON structure and I can't use it. So obviously this datagrid throws errors and when I try looking up coldfusion solutions online or scope out stack overflow, the posts are dated like 6 years back because no one fucking uses CF anymore. My boss loves to jerk to it, it seems because he refuses to change languages cause its all they have ever used. -_- this is 2016 bitch lol

Taught myself assembler at 13 (this was the mid 1980s) and wondered how the hell people could stand to do this. Then I found out there were more abstract languages like BASIC or COBOL. So I taught myself BASIC and MS-DOS batch scripting. Various other languages came later (PROLOG, Pascal, C, Smalltalk, C++, VisualBasic, etc). But it’s never been easy for me because I suck at math and complicated logic structures. Especially not good with OOP. My brain was ruined by learning procedural coding first. It refuses to incorporate OOP.

The more you learn languages like Javascript and Python, the more you realise that while every syntax differs, they're all essentially themes of the same if, else or and, type statements... This leads me to believe that with enough practice, it's possible to shortcut or pick up a new language progressively faster. Or am I just a melon?

Is the way people solve problems intrinsic to the native language they learned growing up? Can the shape of our thoughts be optimal for solving certain kinds of problems? Like sentence structure, grammar, etc.

If the pattern of thoughts a language promotes can help us solve problems. Then is there a spoken language that can help promote solving computer science problems?

I know I have to work to think differently to program in different styles of programming. I wonder if we can learn from different spoken languages patterns of logic that are applicable to engineering.

Mathematics, while not a spoken language, has helped me re-frame things in programming. I think programming has also helped in other areas. Like using binary search to find the end of a pipe in the ground.

Is python a good language for building a RestAPI? Personally I don't have any experience with python yet, but what I've gathered, is that python is great for scripting, and big data.

I have a bit of knowledge about Node.js, and I really like the structure, and it's so easy to make an API using express.js.

I've already read a bunch of articles about it, but I'd like to know what the community feels about the two languages?

For context, I've been working for a couple years now with Rust, and, I have to say, the experience has been astoundingly pleasant. The language is both incredibly productive and meets each of my use cases and stipulations regarding speed, safety, and complexity. That said, I've come to beg the question, "what is the point of functional languages like Haskell?" To me, what seems attractive about Haskell is the inherent thread safety, and the added syntactic niceties of code written in the language. However, one must keep in mind, my experience with Haskell has been pretty limited, simply due to the massive learning curve that the language presents. Such a "learning curve" brings me to my central point: these days with languages like Rust which bring together the best from functional and imperative worlds, it seems like functional languages are becoming increasingly irrelevant. Let's face it: no sane person will choose to learn a functional language as their first language, outside of academia and mathematics, and OOP/OOP-like languages remain dominant in the space. So, why then, is Haskell any different? What benefit do languages like Haskell pose in the modern CS space that thread-safe, non-GC languages don't already provide?

I like finding "the book" for a particular technology. Be it libraries, languages, concepts etc.

I have many for different languages or paradigms. But I noticed that there is one in particular that I do not have something for: CSS

So, my lads, what would you say is THE book in CSS?

I go to the reddit programmers pages, here, the holy stackoverflow and github and it seems like everyone has 2 or 3 languages they know and love... Then i look at job applications and those fuckees want you to know several fluently... :/ ready to uninstall all IDEs

CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG.

Didn't server industry and technology get a little.. stale?

I mean, just look at similar industries
For example - mobile phones, they are everywhere now and each year we get new technology, the new big thing and whatnot.

Other example - gaming, VR came up moderately recently to a usable state, we got a great influx of flexible languages like C#, Java etc.
New engines to build games on top of, new graphical apis like Vulkan and whatnot.

..and Servers? It feels like the last big thing (and makes me feel like the only one) was Cloud Storage.

wdyt?

Fellow Deviants, I need your help in understanding the importance of C++

Okay, I need to clarify a few things:

I am not a beginner or a newbie who has just entered this community...

I have been using C++ for some time and in fact, it was the language which introduced me to the world of programming... Before, I switched to Java, since I found it much better for application development...

I already know about the obvious arguments given in favour of C/C++ like how it is a much more faster and memory efficient than other languages...

But, at the same time, C/C++ exposes us and doesn't protect us from ourselves.. I hope that you understand what I mean to say..

And, I guess that it is a fair tradeoff for the kind of power and control that these languages (C/C++) provide us..

And, I also agree with the fact that it is an language that ideally suits our need, if we wish to deal with compilers, graphics, OS, etc, in the future...

But, what I really want to ask here is:

In this age and times, when hardware has advanced so much, where technically, memory efficiency or execution speeds no longer is the topmost priority... These were the reasons for which C/C++ was initially created...

In today's time, human concept of time matters more and hence, syntactical less complicated languages like Java or Python are much more preferred, especially for domains like application development or data sciences...

So, is continuing with C++, an endeavour worth sticking with in the future or is it not required...

I am talking about this issue since I am in a dilemma about the use of C++ in the future...

I would be grateful if we could talk about keeping AI, Machine Learning or Algorithms Optimisation in mind... Since, these are the fields in which I am interested in...

I know that my question could have been posted in a better way.. But, considering the chaos that is present in my mind, regarding this question doesn't allow me to do so...

Any kind of suggestion or thoughts would be welcome and much appreciated...

P.S: I currently use C++ only for competitive programming or challenges...

I like PHP but every new tech is about all the other languages ! Recently i was searching for microservice architecture and oh it's so easy with nodejs ! It's ready made for Go ! Java has a library build in ! What about Symfony ? Laravel ?

Hello fellow developers!

I know this is devRant, but I don't know of a better community with such diversity of developers like you guys and I need your input.

I decided to go on a language journey. I come from a background of php/javascript and feel the need to expand my horizons.

I'm going to write the same app in each language to get the feel of it and become familiar with the syntax and language concepts.

Since I'm a web developer I'll focus mainly on languages used on the web like: Java, Python, Ruby, etc.. But I want to cover others as well, like Objective-C/Swift, C++/C#.

I'm having trouble figuring out what kind of an app would cover most of the ground. I know the basic guideline for this is a TODO app for web frameworks, but I
don't feel like writing a TODO in Swift or C# really cover what the languages are intended for.

I don't know enough about the environments yet to come up with a good idea.

I want something, that can be language independent but would utilize the power of each language in one part or another and is still simple enough not to require weeks of development.

Does anyone have a brilliant idea what that could be?

Does anyone else have experience on a team where everyone seems to be doing their own thing across the full stack/multiple systems/languages but then they're all stepping over each other, breaking other each other's code so ends up doing a lot of rework to update your code to someone else's change.

And also many wheels get reinvented in slightly different ways because no one is aware that something like ... Already exists and can be reused or refactor.... Or how to use it correctly.

Basically we're like all moving in different directions instead of in sync.

I feel maybe the team is too big and everyone is doing everything, wearing too many hats... and maybe should define roles and ownership better.

What I absolutely love to do is refactoring. With strongly typed languages, I often just remove or change something and then follow the compiler errors to finish the refactoring by fixing them.
It‘s not just a matter of renaming something. I will reliably get all the places in code which are affected by the change.

How do you handle that with weakly typed languages like JS? I can only imagine how horrible of an experience refactoring would be.

Man why is it that the languages that I like get shit on by like 90% of developers. Whiney little cunts that get mad at css because they think "oh I can just inline style and it'll be fine" No wonder your X looks like fucking roadkill. And I fucking love python. Maybe if the Oracle overlord didn't have a goddamn chokehold on ever major hardware manufacturer python would be more prominent.

so they are really out there...

people who beleive C# is just the one source of truth and all other languages are just garbage

🤡

sad to be so ignorant - though i guess ignorance is bliss

to be clear: I use C# like anyone else, but it's just a tool in the toolkit, that's all

We have so much pl/sql at our company and it really sucks because the "young" generation of devs must convince the pl/sql guys to switch to some more powerful and newer languages like java.

But not everyone wants to use the new stuff or learn anything new. I mean there are some programmers who really appreciate that there is new stuff. They have no problem learning from the younger generation. But some of them just resist any change in that direction, and thats the much higher amount of devs.

Does anyone of you have such experience? What can i do against that?
Is that some kind of "i am too old for this"-trip?

I think one of the most amazing things about being a developer is seeing the abstractions that have come about over time. From having to program in machine code and assembly, to now with languages like Java, where a lot of the boilerplate code is effectively abstracted out by frameworks.

i hate people who join the company with a engineering in computer science degree and then can't even setup freaking java on their system.
like that is one of the basic languages taught to programmers, how do you graduate CS yet not know how to setup java!!!!!
this idiot today tired setting up eclipse without java and got errors and comes to me saying your files are corrupt.... i ask what happens and he shows me a error message box saying cannot find java paths... and then says i keep getting this error!!!
like freaking read the damn error and fix it. you're an engineering graduate for gods sake!!!!

I've been trying to diversify programming languages I know.

It's been rough; I just don't like a lot of the high level programming languages and low level ones are often tough to learn to for someone without formal CS background.

Then I tried Go, and you should too!

This is embarrassing, but the first days of learning about AngularJS I had to implement functionality about a new component of the WebApp I was building.

I did a good templating, I build the component along with its controller and services, I verified there wasn’t any memory leak and that everything was in an isolated scope. Yet nothing at all appeared on the app. It took me more than 30 minutes until I realized...

I didn’t put the source code on the index.html file 😅

For people who know more about compiled languages such as C or Java... that’s like not putting your source code file in the makefile. 😅

I felt literally like the dumbest person in the planet at that moment. 😀🔫

I've been writing Java the last few days. Really makes me remember why I enjoy writing objective c / swift so much. It's not necessarily the crazy syntax of objective c. It's the conventions behind the languages. It's very easy to make your code read like prose. Which when you become used to this it's very hard to jump back into spaghetti code with abbreviated variable names and such.

C++ rant, but I'm sure it is similar in other languages.

I cannot stand +=,-=; I understand it is shorter, but for some reason I would prefer seeing: sum = sum + 1; or the like. Am I just too much of a newb to appreciate it, or is it just preference.

Question, have you ever felt like you have been pigeonholed into specific languages? I am feeling more and more like I am getting forced onto projects because to few people know the language (LabVIEW). getting tired of it, and not sure what the way out is.

My "dev specialty" when I first started was Flash and ActionScript. I just wanted to make funny games and shitpost animations on Newgrounds.

Eventually I got steered into building basic websites. Those were the Dreamweaver MX days. JavaScript + jQuery were all the rage.

Then I got a job building SharePoint modules, got exposed to legitimate programming languages like C# and learned more about enterprise software architecture, design patterns, yadda yadda. I started hanging out more with the front-end guys, who taught me SASS and SMACSS and all that jazz.

Eventual jobs kept leaning me towards front-end, so I guess that's the hole I find myself in lately. Sometimes I get a sprinkle of devops, some infrastructure stuff, maybe a little solution design here and there.

Now I maintain shitpost enterprise applications built by other devs who like spaghetti and meatballs. At least I put in funny ASCII art for strings in my unit tests.

So I've been programming for a while now in various languages like C#, JavaScript, etc. I have never understood how to do OOP until I watched the MVA videos on Microsoft's website and I have to say, its made me love C# more and made things so much easier to understand!

I'm already thinking about rewriting my personal projects from scratch lol.

Being a full stack developer has been an amazing journey. Looking at a project and understanding how the entire stack work starting from the mobile apps, APIs and DB is a total bless.

Nevertheless, lately switching context between modern languages has been extremely frustrating.

Swift looks like kotlin, elixir looks like ruby. Hell even swift and ruby are very similar.

Writing ruby in Xcode and wondering why the fuck Xcode complaining. Well no shit, swift is not ruby. Took me 5 mins of head scratching to notice it 😢

Hell I am now writing down the latest language I am working with on my hand to keep track 😂

Any other language: Hey fuckface, you can't name this variable by a single letter, tf is wrong with you? use some descriptive shit.

Golang: lmao fuck u

I really find it interesting how we use short variable names for items in golang. Kinda makes sense when you think of it. Most of these items come up in short methods for which the mental model lets you know and remember what you are doing, they even make sense when going through the std lib in which that shit is all over the place. YET years of going by other languages has made me squint my eyes a bit in frustration every time I see it.
Say for example that a function is implementing io.Writer. What would you call the method parameter? you could argue that writer would be sensible since it has it in the signature, but what about when the io.Writer in itself is a file or a socket or whatever? writer would be funny or strange? nah fuck it just w, it makes sense, but x wouldn't. I find these points to make sense even if i don't like them.

Would, now, this practice be acceptable in C? you are supposed to write the same modular code with C in which you compose large functionality in separated units of code, yet I am sure this practice of single name variables is something that C engineers dislike greatly.

Are go devs just doing this out of blind love for their preference in languages? and how would this work if mfkers add generics to go(I hope not, Go is simple enough to understand in order to extend functionality through the empty interface, but that is a preference of mine as well)

The more I use Go the more I like it to be honest, I think the code looks ugly syntactically, but that is subjective as all hell and based on my constant preference for a language to look like Ruby, which even though it might not be everyone's cup of tea it remains to my eyes as the most beautiful language in existence, again, an obvious personal preference.

Was once interviewing for Ops support roles looking after multiple websites wrote in java, rails, php with some rest apis, apache, varnish and more....

We were also starting moving towards automation and devops practices so we needed to expand...

We have a great CV from someone who had all of the technologies and chef mentioned on their CV so we were positive....

Invited to interview and something wasn't right..... I dropped a "so you mentioned a few different languages on your CV, can you talk me though some of the applications you've looked after and what languages they were written in, etc?"

His reply.. "yes I looked after a lot of applications and helped people with them in English"

Me "oh.. Okay.... So those apps which software languages were they... You mentioned things like Java and Php and automation tech like chef?"

Him "well yes they were all sorts of things but I predominantly looked after the apps that were wrote in English... Didn't deal with any wrote in java or chef... Just English"

Me ".... Does anyone else have any questions?"

Safe to say we didn't offer him the job....

Okay... I need to confess.
I actually like the idea of counting arrays from 1 like it is in some languages.
It makes code cleaner.
Think about it.
You would never need to subtract 1 from count/size/length or add 1 for things like the month in javascript because the first item would be at index 1 and many many errors wouldn't be happening because we don't need to force our minds to think another way. I learned counting from 1 after I learned to walk so it's the most natural thing to do. Just because the software/hardware below our language works that way doesn't mean we can not abstract this behavior away. What's your opinion about this? Am I wrong?

Playing ATM8 Minecraft modpack. I don't know if I have burnout, but I just want to play and zone out after work. On my breaks I look up ways to do things in the game. The game is like this huge lego set to play with tons of different takes on modded minecraft. I can solve the same problem a hundred different ways. Some of those ways will cause lag, some are slow, some are just fast. I can solve things in game using programming languages as well. It all comes down to creativity and experimentation. You can also blow up shit. That is always fun.

Ban visual programming programs, like scratch after the fist month introduce them to enhanced Google search strings and let them code on the command line going from imperative, over functional to object oriented programming styles using languages suited for the current style. Not like using Java from the get go. I hated it, waiting until everyone got to the point where they kind of understood the logic but failed at using correct syntax and efficient coding styles.

Hey everyone!

This is really two things in one:
1). Asking about a good gaming laptop.
2). Follow up on a post I made a while back asking for suggestions for new programming languages to learn

So right now I have a surface pro 3 i7 256gb, it's great for development, but not so great for gaming (Overwatch).
Saw the Razer Blade Stealth and thought it looked pretty nifty. Suggestions?

Also I would like to say a big thank you to all the people who told me about some really cool new languages, like Crystal, Elixir..etc.
Thanks everyone!

the latest recruitard.
so having been unemployed for 14 months, this recruiter shit is infuriating. i think they are the reason for my unemployment.
i just spoke to the biggest idiot ever, she worked for a temp agency called manpower, attempted to solicit a job for the u of a. she was "new and getting used to the technologies in the market" that was her excuse for asking me if java and js were different languages, i mean if you cant understand simple stuff like this, gtfo the industry all you are doing is hurting hard working ppl like me. i cant even get adaquate representation because there is no qualified ppl in charge of delivering me to hiring managers, and you can forget about presenting yourself c level execs dont talk to us plebs we are here for one thing to make them money and get screwed, the last 6 out of 10 jobs i have actually gotten all left me with debit they owed and dissappeared into oblivion.

So my code wasn't working and couldn't understand why. I had a statement like someVar == 'A' but when I wrote the letter A I didn't change my keyboard language from Greek to English and I didn't notice because the letters are the same in both languages. Spent like 8 hours commenting out and debugging code just to re-write all the code cause I thought the compiler is broken or I am losing my mind....

I'm a junior in high school, and I dabble in a few languages like Python and php. What do you think is a good language to pursue in the coming years? I've heard Ruby and php are some of the top. What is your opinion?

Can someone tell me why C++ and python are so widely used in the AI department? I kind of understand… you want maximum performance (plus GPU) with C++ or easy logic with Python but still, it seems like other languages would still have there benefits in AI. It just doesn't make sense to me, why isnt it like every single other part of computer science where everyone under 22 thinks "now this is what JavaScript was made for!" (I mean js is used so much in other parts of cs, why not AI). Am I missing something? Maybe the resources are missing for AI in other languages? Can someone please expand

Let me start by sharing a bit of history about myself.

When i finished my secondary school i did not go immediately to high school. I took a year because i needed to improve some grades to enter high school more easily.
In that year i started to learn programming languages (Java).

So when i went to high school i already had a good foundation of programming logic and could make some simple games that my friends were amazed (Like Pong and tetris).
In my first year in high school, in my hometown, a photo frame builder's shop asked me if i could make a desktop program to help him calculating prices and such.

I did it in like 4 months. This was not my biggest projet so far but was the most satisfying at the end. He paid me really good money for it and i was very proud of myself.

Why people loves Java? It's because the maintenance or something in architectural level? I don't understand, because we have languages like Python with a better syntax and languages like C++ with a better optimization and speed of processing

!rant
I'm almost at the end of my CS degree and I was wondering what it'll be like on the market: do companies want people who know like 10 different languages or are they more focused on actual experience?

I mean in the end a language can be learned fast, imho.

Anyone here worked a whole lot with low level programming?

I have always worked with high level languages like Python and C++, but I’ve also had an interest in working with embedded systems, real close to the metal.

Any directions on where I should go to start learning low level programming? Sites, languages, etc?

Appreciated devRant fam!😊

I know compiled languages will always be the norm for performance applications and operating systems. But do you guys feel like general purpose applications are moving away from compiled languages to interpreted ones? Web apps are exceedingly common now, and even many server infrastructural applications and services are being coded in interpreted languages. Am I observing accurately, or is just maybe my exposure?

I like being diverse in what I can program. I like software development, web development, networking programming, I’m starting to get into embedding programming and using lower level languages like C/C++ (I’ve used them before but not for anything practical) and I enjoy the diversity. It makes me feel good knowing I can extend my programming knowledge.

Also I like having project ideas lined up so I know what I want to do next. And if I don’t finish one I know is easy but I can’t figure out, I CANT MOVE ON! I have to finish it. It’ll drive me fucking nuts.

If I could, I'd attempt to create an ideal language. I'd aspire that its features would be:

-The easyiness of Python

-The library ecosystem of Javascript

-The readability and cross- platformness of Java

-Functional features of Haskell

-Modularity of Lisp

-Low level features of C/C++

-Powerful with strings and data, like Perl

-Both compiled and interpreted, with REPL

Anything missing from your favorite languages?

I get it. Functional code is still kind of considered the "new hotness" in languages like Java, but THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU NEED TO CRAM IT IN EVERYWHERE FOR THE SAKE OF IT. If in doubt, *please* go for the simpler, classic option...

Just inherited a code base that's full of things like this:

Optional.of(getResult()).filter(s -> s.equals(true)).ifPresent(s -> callService());
Optional.of(getResult()).filter(s -> s.equals(false)).ifPresent(s -> logError());

Hey Devrant friends!, i really hope everyone is doing very well today, and that also their week is treating them very well!, i'd like to say to everyone here i'm very sorry for my level of activity within the community.

Approximately one month ago on the 21/01/2019 i lost my best friend and fellow companion for the last 13 and a half years, therefore things have been quite difficult emotionally and just overall :-( though with time things should only get better, (I'm positive) .

Now to more of a positive part of my post :'D, i'd love to ask my fellow developers the following question, if you could help me out i'd be very much grateful!, so for awhile now i had a hobby of messing around with the stock market, and have been re-searching a specific field.

That would be investment-banks such as JP.Morgan, Morgan Stanley etc. What sort of languages would they be using, currently I've been using , C#,C++,Java, Py(learning) :'D, though im not so sure if its a good idea to be juggling so many languages at once, Also i'd love to know do they have opportunities in which allow students like myself to visit such places and see the technology behind the trading and what developers use? i'm really curious, Also are there such positions in which developers work with traders? not really 'quant' type positions, developers who work in the section?.

Friends, i'd like to thank you very much for reading my post, i know it may be quite lengthy and most likely all over the place (im sorry!) , i'm very grateful you have taken the time to do so :-), i really appreciate it!.

I really wish everyone the absolute best <3.

Thank you
Milo <3

!rant

You knoe, my first insights into computer programming came out of spite. I thought windows to be garbage and wanted to blame someone other than myself for my machine constantly crashing. Thus I discovered programming and down the rabbit hole. But my interest in computer science came from videogames. Portal in particular. I found the idea of GlaDOS fascinating and thought that artificial intelligence would be something interesting to research. The web then gave me Lisp, and boy was the language different from all the other languages I went through. I remember feeling super excited when Racket, Common Lisp and eventually Clojure would help me discover many different ideas. Every time I work with reduce or maps or stuff like that in other languages I always thank languages such as Clojure for having me descipher different ways of manipulating data to get a result. To this day I feel sad whenever I find that my languages do not have the same constructs that Clojure has. I mention Clojure because it is my favorite flavor of Lisp. But one thing that always remains grest to me is firing up Emacs and plugin my code to Slime or Cider and see the repl pop up waiting for something to happen. This feeling is beautiful.

Please guys, if you have not tried it, do so! You might hate it at first or push it aside. But trust me, once you get it it will really change the way you think about programming in general. Try the great Clojure for the Brave and true, and go through the third chapter succesfully. If you do not like Lisp by them then no harm done! You would at least know that there are other options.

Now, here are some cool things:
For the standard implementation, try Common Lisp

For a more modern Scheme, try Racket or Guile

For targetting the JVM try Clojure (more akin to Common Lisp) or Kawa (scheme like)

For the python AST get Hy (pun totally intended)

For JS try Clojurescript

For emacs scripting try Emacs Lisp (has way too many disasdvantages but still relatively close to common lisp)

Honorific mention to more pure functional programming languages for Haskell, F#, Ocaml.

Also worth mentioning that Js , Ruby and Python have great functional constructs.

(println "you will not regret it!")

The only thing that I think works great in Node.js ecosystem is Socket.io

Otherwise anything JavaScript related is too bad for me. So many frameworks releasing each month. First it was React then people said that vue is better... Now hearing Svelte is the best. This shit is going crazy.

Personally I prefer to keep back end in a different language such as PHP or Python. Separation of concerns was a thing some years ago now everything is JS.

Are there other alternatives to Socket.io in other languages which are easy to setup just like Socket.io? XMPP is there but I feel it is overly complicated to get started.

I want to rant about tech YouTubers. As one myself, I feel like I do an even exchange with my viewers.

I want your attention, I don't feel like I deserve it, so I teach you something coding related. You get something of value, I get your attention.

But that's not the case with most in this space. Idiots feel like they can spout whatever bullshit they think about.

They're all stupid with their stupid fucking titles and ideas. Let's review some.

Video Title: How much Javascript you should know to get in tech??
Anyone with > 2 braincells: WTF !!!!!

Video Title: How would I start over to learn coding if I could?
My Reaction: Nope, I wouldn't. The things that I did and didn't is exactly what my journey is and I would do it all over again.

And I get the intent, you're trying to put a roadmap for beginners but they're not going to follow exactly how you lay it out. And why are you trying to establish that there is a correct way of learning coding? Everyone learns at different paces at different times. It's a journey not a race.

Video Title: A day in the life of {COMPANY} engineer.
My Reaction: What do you want to show everyone? Your fancy office? Your perks? The job perks which 99% of other devs won't have?

Video Title: How to crack FAANG interviews.
My Reaction: Well, only the top 1% is going to get an interview anyway. You're not acknowledging the fact that the acceptance rate is < 1% in these companies. Creating a video like this creates false expectations in beginner's heads. And they only see these companies as their only shots of making careers. They dont consider startups or starting their own companies.

Video Title: Top 4 dying programming languages.
My Reaction: WTF !!! COBOL was invented in 1959 and there still is demand for it. And my blood started boiling when Tiff in Tech said PHP is a dying language. Like seriously????

Video Title: Top paying programming languages in 2023.
My Reaction: Please, come on. We know it's Java. And 99% of the viewers ain't getting that job. You're just wasting time listing out languages. By the time someone starts from scratch and gets to a position of getting a job, something else will be the new fad.

Video Title: What advice would I give myself when I was starting?
My Reaction: Really? You couldn't think about saying what advice you'd give to your viewers? Are you really that full of narcissism?

There are good techies though, it's just that I get angrier and angrier the more YouTube recommends me these stupid videos. Ah, my chest feels lighter now.

So where I work now, there is this developer in my team who I feel like doesn't know how to do any kind of tests for web apps. I was given the task of testing some of their additions to the application we develop and, I swear, it's like they never even made a dent in the application according to what they were supposed to do.

So instead of testing the "changes", I basically had to rewrite the entire part of the application that was their responsibility! It was like they didn't even know what was going on at all and this developer has been working at the company for two decades!

I'm kind of tired of dealing with this developer at this point because project management is constantly pushing some of their tasks on to me because they can't seem to finish it for some reason. :-/

Obviously, I will continue to work with this co-worker of mine because they are a member of the team and respect them as a member, but seriously, they should do more research on their own time of modern web development languages and frameworks to save us all a headache. They came from the world of desktop app development so I feel they haven't adjusted to the industry change very well.

Alright, epic throwback to high school
-So I'm taking this CS course on java
-Teacher seems legit
-Knows his shit
-Gets the job done
-Introduces the class to an IDE
-Such wow
-I whip out my Eclipse Oxygen (with Hello World preloaded, obviously) like the nerd I am
-Suddenly:
-BlueJ
-Literally the worst editor ever
-And teacher somehow expects us to work in it with git

WTF.

For those of you who have never worked with BlueJ, thank God you haven't.

/end rant

What new languages should I learn? I'm working on C++, but PHP seems fun...

My apologize to everyone I told that functional programming is declarative.

It's actually imperative. Thank you @AndSoWeCode for figuring that out. I spent the whole day thinking about it.

Lisp is imperative. It's just different way to define the exact data transformations, and that's quite imperative.

On the other hand, HTML, CSS, config files and markup languages are declarative.

But writing the imperative program which is configured with declarative configs seems like great idea. Consider Apache web server and others.

I feel like saying "I know C#" (or Java or other similar languages) to mean that you know it as a language as opposed to more of a framework is ridiculous. We should say what programming language level we know (high, mid, low...) since the difference between say C# and Java is pretty much the same as the difference between say WinForms and WPF. Depending on which two languages and which two frameworks you choose it can be a much bigger difference between the frameworks than the languages.
In a CV I'd like to say "I know x-level languages with experience in [actual programming language + frameworks]" instead of saying I know C# and then recruiters and HR people and such assume I don't know Java at all, but know MVC, WebForms and whatever else even though I might specialise in something else and would take me pretty much the same to get proficient in Java as it would take me to get proficient in that framework or something that's technically C#.
It just makes so much more sense to me. As a dev you're supposed to know the principles, the syntax should be secondary. A pointer is a pointer regardless of it's marked with a * or IntPtr or just a value in a register with no special marking that it's a pointer...
Can we, as devs, come up with something like this?

Admitting a few things: I found myself ranting multiple times about multiple programming languages and how it's their fault things didn't go my way, I'd like to take the time to admit that I was wrong, not understanding the language was because of my lack of experience with it and patience to understand. So here's my two cents : if you're ranting about a programming language/ framework being bad, you're probably inexperienced and don't know how to use it right. I was retarded for blaming languages such as php and using typescript as being bad even though I was clearly inexperienced with them, sometimes I see a bunch of retards bashing great languages and libraries such as bootstrap, bitch if you can't manage to understand how to copy paste some css classes then you will probably never be able to write css and should consider working as truck driver. It's been a month now in my new company and my skill level has increased exponentially, we are almost ready to launch our app and I have in someway become super excited about learning new tech.

I am from a third world country. Although I went to one of the better schools in my neighborhood, the education didnt work out very well for me (maybe because I wasn't the brightest kid in class). Nothing made much sense except math, but didnt do very well at that either since the number of equations I had to memorize increased every year and I hated memorizing. One day programming started to make sense and from then I got the best scores in the class for programming, somewhat decent scores in math and languages and barely made it for other subjects.

I just continued doing the only thing I was good at. I am really curious about physics, chemistry, biology and other subjects and I religiously watch youtube videos and read articles explaining related concepts. Maybe I would have followed a different career path if my science teachers made any sense. Or maybe I am too dumb for that.

Is programming for me? I am still not sure but I know this is something I like.